If you’re interested, through my extensive network of sources, I have the team’s arrival info if you’d like to welcome them back to Oklahoma and show your support. I think they could use a lift. They will be back this afternoon, arrriving at Will Rogers, Hanger 2 & 3 again, at 3:30-3:45. So head on over there, clap for them when they get off the plane, chant “BEAT LA” and maybe score a high five or something.
J.A. Adande with thoughts on last night’s game: “The Thunder don’t have a Dwight Howard to single-handedly deter shots. That might even work to their advantage. Players get lured into thinking they have a layup, then a long arm — be it Kevin Durant’s or Serge Ibaka’s or someone else’s — appears to knock the ball away. They blocked 17 shots Tuesday, the most ever by a Lakers’ opponent in the playoffs. It was so bad that Lamar Odom wound up shooting a rarely seen fallaway hook shot.”
Zach Harper of HP: “But this was a good next step for the Thunder to make. Limiting the role players worked. Getting Kevin Durant to knock down some shots worked. Defending the paint worked (17 blocked shots). Holding your own on the rebounding battle didn’t work (49-37). Getting other guys outside of KD to hit shots didn’t work (17/48 for 35.4%). However, the youngest team in the NBA took the defending NBA champs down to a decent three-point look from the NBA’s leading scorer with 15 seconds left in the game and down only two on the road.”
Sam Amick: ”Everyone in the room knew this series may have just ended, that these young Thunder had missed two reachable chances to win on the defending champions’ home floor and now face the tall task of winning four out of five. But rest assured, the buzz surrounding these boys will resume in full force soon enough. For years to come.”
Darnell Mayberry: “Offensively, the Thunder is struggling. Kevin Durant and Russell Westbrook were the lone players who had anything going offensively. Nenad Krstic contributed a little in the third like he always does. But someone has to be able to make shots. Jeff Green needs to be that guy. He went 2-for-11 tonight, 1 of 6 from 3, and is now averaging 11 points on 27.2 percent shooting.”
Berry Tramel: ”And Green’s got to shoot better. He was 2-of-11, including the final-shot miss, and a solid game from Green might be enough to give the Thunder a blowout over the Lakers somewhere in this series. Aside from Durant and Westbrook, the Thunder made just 12 of 38 shots. Someone has to start helping on offense. But on defense, the Thunder was superb. Terrific guarding and those flurry of blocked shots. It wasn’t a victory, but it was enough to make you think the Thunder is coming back to Los Angeles very soon.”
Darius of FB&G: “The Thunder are an athletic and scrappy team. They just fight for every inch and play hard for every second. You see it in how they front the post, how the rotate on defense, and how they protect their basket. They had 17 blocks in this game. 17! Through sheer will and determination, they hustled back on defense, clogged the paint, and contested every shot taken. After the game when Scott Brooks spoke of being proud of his guys and praised them even in defeat, I understood exactly what he was saying – his guys battled, but they came up short. After games like this you don’t hold your head or get down on yourself. You use it as inspiration for the next game. The Lakers better be prepared for that when game 3 rolls around. Because the Thunder will play this same style, but they’ll have an amazing crowd pushing them to play even harder.”
Chris Mannix of SI with a few thoughts: “Get to know Serge Ibaka. Many questioned why Thunder GM Sam Presti didn’t make a play for a defensive-minded center like Marcus Camby at the trade deadline. Ibaka is why. Acquiring Camby would have made sense in the short term, but Presti has never stopped looking at the Thunder through a long-term lens. And through that lens he sees Ibaka as the defensive stopper the Thunder need. In 28 physical minutes, the 6-foot-10, 235-pound Ibaka (six points, five rebounds) banged bodies with the bigger Bynum and Gasol, finishing the game a team-high plus-six. The experience Ibaka is getting now is only going to make him a more effective player down the line.”
Major congrats to the Tulsa 66ers who locked away a spot in the D-League Finals last night by defeating the Iowa Energy 127-122. Latavious Williams had a big game with 19 points and 9 rebounds.
If you’ve never heard of Synergy Sports, it’s an amazing place that logs so much basketball information that your head might fall off. They have released their services to the general public for a low cost. You can watch game tape, find out how many iso plays Kevin Durant has had this season and so much more.
Dwight Howard was named Defensive Player of the Year yesterday in a landslide, but Thabo Sefolosha grabbed two first place votes and finished eighth overall.
Sebastian Pruiti breaks down a crucial play late in the game last night. He noticed something I didn’t. It was the same play OKC ran against Boston that got Jeff Green back-to-back 3s.
A solid comment after last night’s game from reader Todd: “Just heard on the news that the Lakers were late leaving L.A. for OKC this morning. They were about to lift off the runway when Ibaka jumped up and swatted the plane back to the terminal.”
Kevin Durant said again yesterday, this time to NBA.com writer Scott Howard-Cooper, that he wants to be in OKC: “If it doesn’t happen this summer, as long as I know I’m going to be here, then I’m happy,” Durant said. “And if it happens the summer after that, fine. I would like to get it tied down as quick as possible. But if it doesn’t happen like that, then everything happens for a reason. I’ll still be happy to be here and come to work every day and be a great person and the great teammate that I am. It’s all about just knowing that where there’s a will there’s a way. I’ll get done if it’s in the plans.”
Green has shown flashes of being a good shooter, just can't put it together, Lewis is 230 lbs, not that bulky. Just saying defensively Howard mitigates the lack of Lewis' size.
Rashard Lewis is a far greater shooter and offensive player than Jeff Green. Don't like that comparison much.. plus even though he's not huge he has gained weight since his Sonics days.
It would be nice if Kevin Durant could improve his handling but that just might not be his game. Our offense is crippled because we only have one play maker / passer in the game at a time (Westbrook / Maynor). I think some of the judgements should be withheld until next year but a lot of Durant's turnovers could be prevented if we had a real offensive scheme. We're very predictable...
We are a long term team, which means you have to wait and rely on who you drafted, otherwise you could over commit to a FA. Would David Lee be nice? Sure, it would be nice to have a true center that Ibaka can play with because he is much more useful as a PF than a C. But we are stuck with Kristic, which isn't a bad thing, he is just much better suited to come off the bench and not start against bynum and gasol. Camby would have been perfect but with green/kristic/Collison/Ibaka there wasn't room. Presti has to decide pretty quick if he really thinks a green/kristc starting combo can win a playoff series against a big team, I don't think they can, unless Green is shooting really well. We probably would have won if he had shot his normal season %. We have too many role players down low, when green is hitting his shots, his lack of size on the defensive end is made up with offense, its Kristc's in ability to rebound and defend down low that makes green seem so out of place. Rashard Lewis isn't any more physical than green, but he works cuz he plays with Howard, we don't need a howard, just a rebounding defender. Collison in my mind is the one that will end up on the short stick, the team doesn't need PF, it needs centers, nick is pretty undersized at center which isn't good when your starting PF is undersized.
Also, if KD can spend an offseason and go from being a defensive liability to a respected defender, then he should be able to focus on ball-handling skills and greatly improve that, just way too man stupid mistakes, partly due to a lack of strength, he really needs to bulk up more for a lot of reasons.
It sure would be nice if Jeff Green/James Harden/Thabo Sefolosha could put the ball in the basket.
I think getting a shooter is our biggest need this offseason. Even a big man isn’t as pressing a need. Ray Allen will be available right? Any chance he plays for the former Sonics?
Right now, the Lakers are sagging off Thabo to double KD. Imagine if that was Ray Ray out there waiting to pop open 3’s. KD would have more room to operate.
Plus Ray’s only 34 and is FA this summer. He’s got a couple good years left. I don’t think he’d command that high a salary. He’s a great person and teammate. I loved him when I was a Sonics fan. Go get him Presti!
Good story on Russell: http://www.latimes.com/sports/la-sp-heisler-westbrook-20100422,0,5039446.column
@Vince
I don't think anyone's really considering trades that involve PG, SG, and SF.. everyone seems to be on the same page that 'something' has to be done with the front court. The rest of the conversation is really just idle chatter to fill in the gaps between games.
It's likely we'll see a change or two in the front court and that's it, you are correct. But that's really all that's being discussed anyway - changes to the front court. There's minor rumblings about Thabo and Harden, but those seem reactionary (at least in Harden's case).
In all, it's been a great year and it's fun to follow this team as a fan, and you're right that most fanbases would trade with us in a heart beat. But I don't think trade scenarios or talking trades is defeatist.. even the best teams do it. It's fun to think about.
@Vince
True that dog!
justin :@Vince
It’s defeatist to think that this is the team and that’s it. I don’t think the team as constructed can win a championship… but you never know. I guess we didn’t know what we had with Ibaka before the year so maybe there are surprises yet to come, and under the radar acquisitions.
I don't think it's defeatist at all. I'm certainly not saying that ten years from now 7 of the 9 guys in this year's rotation will still be here, or that the 9-man rotation is untouchable. But really -- who are we going to replace? One or two guys at the big spots. The 1-3 are set unless we have to give up Harden/Thabo in a big deal. (Maybe you don't think they SHOULD be, but with financial considerations and the youth there I doubt any changes.) So we're talking one, maaaybe two changes up front. I don't say that to be defeatist. I love this guys. I want them to win. If they need help, fine. (And, of course, whether or not this roster can win a title is the $25,000 question. Probably deserves its own thread, as it changes your entire viewpoint.)
What I find more defeatist is the commenters on here who forget what our guys (yes, "our") have done, and come up with laundry lists of replacements who aren't even improvements. You don't like Jeff Green at the 4? Fine. At least you're consistent, and not kicking him off the team because he stunk for two games. The generally negative tone of this board -- which has come up mostly in the last couple of months -- is ridiculous. There are ~25 other fanbases who would kill to have what we have as fans.
Harden in his prime will be a complete player. Good defender both man to man, and team. He will be a good 3 point shooter, penetrate, have good efficiency, and will be a good passer.
Yes we need more offense but I think Harden develops into that 2nd option. Plus we have to take into account the development of our core guys and more practice time on offense. I think this roster as is is a Championship caliber team with natural progression from our players.
With another smart acquisition or 2 I think this team can be the best in the league down the road.
David Lee making the All Star team shot his price way up. I don't know who represents him but if he gets less than LaMarshmallow then he should fire whoever it is.
@Vince
I dunno.. I think people realize now is the time to add a piece (this offseason, anyway). We need a second option offensively, you'd stated as much.
It's defeatist to think that this is the team and that's it. I don't think the team as constructed can win a championship... but you never know. I guess we didn't know what we had with Ibaka before the year so maybe there are surprises yet to come, and under the radar acquisitions.
@justin
He could. I think the question for the 2nd tier guys this off-season is whether a) they're going to get overpaid because there's more cap space out there than stars to fill it, so GM's are going to have to talk themselves into SOMETHING if they don't get LBJ/Wade/Bosh/Amare or b) with the possible lockout and a very likely cut in the players' share of revenues, GM's are more wary of having a 2nd-tier guy tying up 20-25% of their salary in 2012-2013. I honestly don't know the answer - knowing NBA GM's I'd lean more toward option A, but who knows?. I still think Lee has a strong shot to stay in NYC if they don't get LeBron, because the fans there do like him and Walsh is going to have to sell something for 2011-12 if James stays in Cleveland.
Mark! :@Vince
Once again, I’m the one who made mention of a “defensive anchor”
It was only in relation to what we do with our crappy draft pick this year.
It was only in a scenario where we pick up a free agent like David Lee.
It would be nice to have a big body to throw at someone like Bynum, for example.
Geez.
I wasn't just pointing at you...it was up and down this thread and it's been all year with the nonsense of needing a defensive big man. There's simply no evidence for it. We are a bit weak (16th) in defensive rebounding rate, but other than that interior defense is a strength, not a weakness. And, like you, I would be for a big body late in the first round, if only because I'm not sure where you're going to put anyone who plays the 1-3 other than Tulsa. And it almost seems like with the young bigs in the league (Millsap, Lee, Glen Davis, DeJuan Blair, Robin Lopez and Ibaka all in the back of the 1st round or lower), you're better off picking low. (Horford is the only top-5 big of the past three years I can think of who would be picked again in the same spot).
My larger point is that we need to be realistic...this is the team, minus one or two moves. As you noted with the salary issues, there's not that much flexibility here. It seems like this board has quickly turned from being supportive and patient to vindictive, impatient, and impractical.
man 125m/6yr.... man putting it that way that is alot of smackaroos! It stinks that there are no better options for us in free agency........
@Mark!
D. Lee will probably get more than 5/55 this offseason. He'll get at least what LMA got (5/65), maybe more.
@Keith
I'm with ya. I was more or less just looking at a salary spread among players.
Yes, we can fill the roster with minimums and picks, but that makes the $66M at least $71M. Not sure OKC will do that, especially committing to that in light of the looming CBA talks.
2014-15 is an even more concentrated salary situation with Durant/Westbrook/Bosh earning ~$51.9M alone.
I'm not saying it's a bad idea. Just saying I'd be shocked if the Thunder did it. Completely shocked. And I think there are safer bets w/o too large a step down from Bosh... I don't think that max decreasing for Lee is completely unreasonable. $55M/5yr is probably about what he's worth.
Signing Bosh to a $125M/6yr contract is risky...
I think bosh would be great. He should be worth his value for years to come which means if we decide to unload his contract for a different prospect or for a different look for the starting lineup we would be able to.. Of course barring any career ending or career diminishing injury it actually would be a safe pick up for us. If his stock crapped out in a few years of course that would suck but doubtful that would happen. I see the negatives and postives.. and I think the positive FAR FAR out weight the negatives! We got the foundation for a great team. Its like what one poster said on here. Its not like the cavs who had to shifting and trading their team around to build around Lebron. We already got that!
@justin
Ibaka is our best defensive rebounder, but even he is only 43rd in the league in DRR for players playing any significant minutes. I'm beginning to think someone who can swallow up defensive rebounds may very well be able to make up for any lack of defending just by doing that.
It'd be nice to have that core (Russ / Durant / Bosh) and just add pieces around them.
Remember we'll have draft picks too.. trades available. If anything is the Spurs model, that's it. Three great players surrounded by cheap role players.
@Mark!
Just to be fair, look at how many of the names you listed for Portland are on rookie contracts. How many of those names get dumped or significantly increase their cap number in the same time Durant/Westbrook do? Oden, if he can stay healthy even for a single year, will be a 10 million player or more. Batum is essentially what we wish we had from Thabo, and if he keeps the starting SF job probably makes 7+ million.
Just looking at next year isn't a fair comparison. We'll be paying less, even with Bosh, than Portland will regardless. By the time Westbrook's extension kicks in, Portland will have to have extended Oden, Batum, and Bayless or let them go. And for that matter, by that time, Camby, Przybilla, and Miller (if they still have them, will have to spend to replace them otherwise) will all be over the hill. Our guys will all still be in their prime.
We're still pretty poor at getting defensive rebounds. Last night's game, Lakers' second chance points were the difference.
@Vince
Once again, I'm the one who made mention of a "defensive anchor"
It was only in relation to what we do with our crappy draft pick this year.
It was only in a scenario where we pick up a free agent like David Lee.
It would be nice to have a big body to throw at someone like Bynum, for example.
Geez.
@Vince
Agreed. I think there was some concern about our defense to end the season but it's really gotten back to a nice point here in the playoffs. We could use a big body to get defensive boards but that's about it.
We desperately need that #2 option though...
@Keith
I'll have to look at other teams to see if that comparison really holds up. I can't say for sure, I can just tell you that looking at OKC in 2013-14 w/ Bosh looks implausible to me.
We have a lot of contracts coming up for extension that year (all rookies from this season), but for arguments sake, say we don't extend any of them and we just make qualifying offers to retain them for their last year, meaning the following year they would be UFA.
That means our roster is: Durant (max extension), Harden, Westbrook (9/10... extension), Sefolosha, Maynor, Ibaka, Bosh (Bird max) [also assumes we lose Green as part of sign + trade for Bosh)
That's 7 core players for $66.0M. We'd still have to get up to the league minimum 12 players.
Compare that to Portland next year: Camby (assume $9M), Pryzbilla, Miller, Aldridge, Oden, Webster, Roy, Bayless, Fernandez, Batum, Mills, Pendergraph, Cunningham.
That's 13 players (not all core) for $66.7M
Key differences: Next year's Portland team has their salary spread a lot more evenly that the hypothetical 2013-14 OKC team, so it can deal with injury better. Theoretically.
Also, the $66.7M for the Blazers next year should put them south of the luxury. I would be shocked if $66M is south of the luxury in 2013-14.
Not saying I completely disagree. It's a good comparison. I'm just leery when I think there are safer financial options that shouldn't result in a drastic difference on the court (for example, that decreasing David Lee contract I posted earlier.)
Can we please stop having these silly conversations about the front-court and how we need "a defensive anchor"? We blocked 17 bleeping shots last night -- a franchise record for us and allowed by the Lakers (the Lakers!). We led the league in blocked shots. We had nearly an unprecedented improvement in defensive efficiency year-over-year with primarily the same cast. Krstic goes out for three games and everyone on the board says, "Boy, he's really underrated on defense" and now we're back to talking about big-contract stiffs like Haywood and Dalembert or low 1st-round big men who won't replace Krstic, Collison, or Ibaka any time soon.
As Justin said, if you can get Bosh or Lee or Jefferson, you get them. Why? Because they're damned good basketball players. That's why. You figure out the other stuff later. This team needs OFFENSE. A solid, second scoring option to prevent teams like, oh say the Lakers, from doing exactly what the Lakers have done to KD for the last two games. Harden and Green are supposed to be those guys, but they haven't been this series. I think you stay patient with them (particularly Harden) and if you can unload a bunch of assets for a big-time #2, you do it.
@justin
It's honestly chilling to think about.
@JelloPuddinPup
There's no comparison between Eddy Curry (career underachiever and overeater)/Elton Brand (coming off a possible career ending injury) and Bosh. A much better comparison is Pau. Both languished their careers on bad teams, taking a group of nobodies further than they should have gone, but not enough to make a team all the good by himself. And, I think both would suddenly flourish, gaining all sorts of praise, once they were able to use their considerable skill on a contender.
Ibaka / Bosh / Durant would probably be the most athletic / longest frontcourt in the league.
@Steve H
Bosh has all but played center for Toronto his whole career. O'Neal took over those duties for all of 41 games, but who else has Bosh ever had next to him. Bargnani, a glorified SF? Rasho Nesterovic? The fact is, Bosh has consistently had to guard (and be guarded by) the opponent's best big, regardless of position.
He even bulked up this year preparing to play more center. He would easily start next to Ibaka here. We would probably still call him a PF (like Duncan), but he would play center. For his contract, on a team perfectly suited to take him to a championship, I don't know any reason he would complain.
justin :
Honestly, if signing Bosh is possible I say you do it and worry about the ramifications later on.
I think someone once said that to Isiah Thomas/Knicks about Eddy Curry and Jared Jeffries, and also the Sixers about Elton Brand.
Just sayin'. Some were already past their prime, others were just playing the last season for a paycheck and quit after they got it. Besides, I HIGHLY doubt, even in as much of a slam-dunk deal as signing Bosh would be, that the Thunder's management would not worry about future ramifications. My guess is that they've already been worrying about possible future ramifications about possible deals for a few weeks/months. That's just the awesome front office we have.
@Mark!
Not a perfect comparison, but not an unfair comparison. KD didn't come in with as much hype as Lebron, but he is quickly putting himself on the map as a player "you just have to watch, whenever he's on TV." Remember that winning is going to be huge next a lot more than this year. How many national TV appearances do you expect? Anytime we are playing on a Thursday and it's not coinciding with Lebron, I bet TNT picks up the broadcast. We are a marketable brand. We shouldn't confuse this year with anything afterwards. We were expected to be terrible, and were scheduled as such. Next year we will be expected to contend and be exciting, a perfect recipe for drawing in viewers.
I did read your breakdown, and even appreciated it being laid out for everyone. But, it does gloss over a bit that that is the cost of doing business. Portland has two huge extensions kicking in next year, yet didn't bat an eye at spending 9 million a year on a 36 year old center (when 2 other centers are already on the roster). Nor did it stop them for overpaying Andre Miller when they were the only ones really bidding (they bought him just for trade bait initially, what does that say about money?).
9 of the top 10 teams (NY the exception) in team salary are in the playoffs. 3 of the bottom 10 are in the playoffs (Atlanta, OKC, Portland). OKC and Portland are both lucking out on rookie contracts, with Portland is going to be in the 60 million range already next year. Atlanta is already paying 65 million, and that will only go up if they retain Joe Johnson. 51 million for 2 superstars and an all-star isn't that hard to swallow. Another 14 million on Ibaka/Green and Harden (should he continue to improve) puts us at Atlanta's payroll, but with a perennial contender and possible championship team.
Honestly, if signing Bosh is possible I say you do it and worry about the ramifications later on.
However, as Mark has outlined, it's unlikely that route will be taken knowing Presti. I don't think we need Bosh to get to the championship level. I still believe Al Jefferson or Kevin Love would be sufficient, or players on that level. David Lee. That type of number two option.
@Ryan
Salary issues aside, I think my biggest qualm about going after Bosh is that his presence could/would limit Ibaka's potential growth. He COULD be effective as a slightly undersized but athletic center- but he SHOULD be fantastic as our primary (minute wise) power forward. He's a friggin 20 year old rookie from the Congo, and he is already a strong defensive and rebounding presence that can honest to God shoot the basketball. If he masters a post move or two, he will be playing in the all-star game one of these days.
@Keith
Obviously we need an efficient scoring option + rebounder in the post. The "defensive anchor" in the post was coming from the perspective of grabbing David Lee in FA and where to go from there. It was also in response to mr. bill's comment about Ibaka being the center of the future; I don't think he has the size to get most of his minutes at center.
No way can we afford Bosh. I put up a pretty detailed post about the expenses involved on this page a few posts up (#8). In 2013-14, we'd need $51.7M tied up in Durant, Westbrook, Sefolosha, and Bosh ALONE. For all we know, ~$50M might BE the cap in 2013-14.
Cleveland is not a fair comparison for OKC. Lebron is a much more visible star because he actively seeks visibility. Fortunately for us, Durant does not, otherwise he probably wouldn't be nearly so adamant about his desire to stay here. Nevermind that Cleveland destroys every team in local Nielsen ratings. Plus, the Cleveland ownership group sold 15% of their stake in the team to a Chinese business group. Maybe I'm naive, but I don't see that flying quite as well in OKC.
Not a fair comparison at all.
I think one thing is clear from this season and now the postseason; if the Thunder want to be a championship caliber team, they probably need to make an upgrade in the frontcourt, both offensively and defensively. A guy who can score in the post and a guy who can block shots and rebound at a high level on the other end. I see three approaches Presti can take.
1. Don't Touch It: Keep the same rotation this year and hope to see some further development from Green and especially Ibaka. If Ibaka is the player he was last night, he can play center in this league. If you do this, your will continue to struggle against huge frontlines like the Lakers but if you get offensive improvement from Green and Ibaka, you could probably mitigate that. Low post scoring and rebounding would remain an issue but if the development continues, the offense would be improved.
1. Tinker With It: Stick with Green as the primary power forward and try to get a little bigger at the center position via trade or free agency. A guy like Haywood or Dalembert would be possibilities. Under that scenario, Collison or Kristic would likely have to go. You would have some flexibility to go with Ibaka / big center against big front lines and Ibaka and Green in fast tempo games. The remaining big man between kristic and collison would continue to get some minutes. You would be improved at the defensive end and on the boards, but still lack a low post scorer. That defensive improvement might be enough, however, to overcome that given the perimeter weapons and athleticisim you would have on the floor
3. Go Big: Go for a all-star caliber four man to replace Green. I see three main options but there might be more. Obviously, Bosh in a sign and trade would be ideal. I think the Thunder should offer Green, Harden, Collison and maybe picks and see if Toronto would bite (anyone know if that would be feasible salary-wise?). This would clearly improve the offense and give you a post presence. Bosh is not a great defender but he is bigger than Green and a far superior rebounder. With Bosh/Ibaka/Kristic/White/Mullens and a possible draft pick, you would have a championship caliber team as early as next year. Again, that is the ideal scenario.
Other possibilities would include David Lee and Carlos Boozer. As Lee is a free agent you wouldnt have to give much up, but there would not be minutes for everyone so at least someone would have to go. I don't believfe Boozer is a free agent but he likely could be had as well. I would not be willing to part with Harden and Green for Boozer, but would be willing to give up Green and Collison maybe.
Just my thoughts, happy to hear other peoples as well. I just think with Russ/Maynor at the point, Harden/Thabo at the 2 guard and Durant at the 3, you are set on the wings and will likely be a playoff team year in and year out. What Presti does at the four five will determine if this is a consistent championship contender. Given his history, I trust his judgment.
@Mark!
Defensive rebounder is more important than shotblocking anchor. Just think of how good our defense would be just by elimination 50% of the current second opportunities. I honestly don't think there is anyone in the draft who can help in less than 3 years (at least where we are picking). Maybe we luck into somebody, but it would be a lot better for us to trade those picks for a solid player.
I do think we can afford Bosh. Two max contracts is steep (though Durant will be underpaid even at that initial max contract), but nowhere near backbreaking. The point is that we already have the players we need outside of a big man. We won't have to scramble around trying to put together a team like Cleveland, Boston, or even LA. Our ownership group is what determines how much the team can cost, and they aren't going broke by any means.
If Cleveland can afford their team, I think we can afford Bosh.
@DXL
I read somewhere that Ibaka was being looked at(last year) as a lottery player this next draft.
Either way I truly think that both of Harden and Ibaka should see between 25-30 minutes per game next year. I would prefer Ibaka get about 35 minutes to see how he does. He is very well conditioned and really seems to be blossoming offensively.
@mr. bill
Six of one, half dozen of the other to me. We just need a big body that can anchor things defensively. With Durant, Westbrook, Lee (or whoever), we don't need much offensively. Whiteside is projected fringe lottery right now, but a lot can change.
I honestly don't see much difference. Both are raw big guys. I don't think anybody has a bead on how to accurate project talent for those types of players. Ibaka was a hit, but Mullens looks like a miss. How can you tell?
I can't get over just how good a pick Ibaka at 24th in the first round has turned out to be. If he were included in the 2010 draft he'd probably go no later than 4th, maybe even 3rd. He has less potential than Wall or Turner; he's even with Cousins; and he's better than Aldrich, Favors, Aminu, Wes Johnson and everyone else in the draft. What a pick!
@Mark!
yeah, I agree. ibaka/lee could work against some frontcourt matchups, but still need another big with more height to fill out the rotation. krstic is still there obviously, but with lee, his strengths would be a bit negated as lee is better at the things he does well. don't know about alabi - only 2 blocks and 6 boards a game at that height? if whiteside falls, he would tough to pass up.
I'm fine with Green starting at the 4 spot, as long as Ibaka is getting 30 min or so at PF and is on the floor at the end. Bosh would be great, but is probably pie in the sky. Send Mullens and our 1 pick to Orlando for Gortat (they could use the savings to put towards reupping Barnes and Reddick), Collison, PHX's & MIN's picks to the rebuilding Warriors for Biedrins, and we have a sweet center rotation for next year and many yrs to come.
My other thought is to see how we do. We're a year (or more) ahead of schedule as predicted by almost every NBA analyst. We were supposed to make a nice run but the playoffs were at least a year, if not more away. Now that we're here and people are seeing what we can do, we see the potential in growth for this entire team. If a team can make the playoffs, play the defending champs close (both teams playing "poorly" IMO due to 2 very good defensive teams), and is the youngest team in the NBA, what is the harm in actually waiting to see how the current players develop in another year in the league?
Has anyone from the Thunder front office mentioned their desire to get a "big man"? I would doubt such a statement has been made in public seeing how tight-lipped Presti usually is.
I don't buy Ibaka as a starting center. Lee/Ibaka/Collison is a great foundation for a frontcourt, but it still needs a big body in the center to anchor it defensively and I don't really see one on the market.
I guess just draft Alabi and pray he's worth more than 6 fouls?
really need to pull the trigger on lee. ibaka/lee frontcourt would be killer for years to come. they would complement each other really well.
@MastrMatt
You can't wait and see how the CBA will work out before signing Bosh. I'm not worried about the ownership group going over cap, but signing Bosh is committed to going over luxury in 2013-14 for all intents and purposes. I don't see that happening. If you think there's pressure to win now, just wait 3 years when we have Bosh, Durant, Westbrook, no one else, and an unwieldly cap situation.
If we could sign David Lee to a max descending contract, that would be pretty great for us. It would look like:
2010-11: $13.2
2011-12: $12.2
2012-13: $11.1
2013-14: $10.0
2014-15: $9.0
It totals out to $55.5, which is roughly that same as a 10/11/... contract ($60M).
Not quite as favorable for Lee since it decreases his value when he's trying to sign a new deal, but there are a lot of question marks too. Who knows what the new CBA will look like or how much effect his previous year contract will affect his next contract. %55.5M/5yr is nothing to sneeze at.
With a contract like that, all the problems mentioned above w/ Bosh are pretty much corrected.
@Mark!
Who says the ownership group isn't willing to go over the cap to keep everyone. If Bird rights stick around, we'll just have to be willing to pony up the dough. Losing Maynor isn't a big loss. We can draft another back up PG or sign a FA on the cheap. If Harden improves like I think he will, we'll pay him some nice money and Serge will need to be paid too. Really, we'll need to see how the whole lockout / new CBA thing works out.
@j-mo
See my post exactly 3 responses above yours.