This week Nick Gibson of SLAM Online returns to give us an on site report of how our Thunder players are holding up in Turkey. We talk Russell Westbrook, Kevin Durant, Nenad Krstic, and about our boy Tibor Pleiss as well as plenty of chatter regarding the FIBA tournament and everyone’s favorite subject Ricky Rubio.
Be sure to check in next week for our live call in show taking place after the gold medal game. Take a minute and subscribe to our new iTunes channel that’s linked, then listen, and then enjoy.
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@Bender
Yup, we double checked it. The iphone can download this podcast directly from itunes with no problem.
@Bender
Are you still trying the old itunes account? We've tested several iPhones on the new itunes account and they've had no such error. Though they did with the old account.
@Brad
The problem is not that it is uploaded to Itunes. It is. The podcast will download and then report an error, with options to retry or delete. Retrying doesnt help. This is not an Iphone problem, other podcasts work just fine, and other iphones do the same thing.
@Jax Raging Bile Duct
Jason Williams had a 3Y peak of 12.5 - 2.6 - 7.7 and a 1Y peak of 14.8 - 3.0 - 8.0 which is very consistent with Tinsley.
@Joel
That's not an unfair assumption, but it's based on something unseen and unproven. We have no idea what kind of work ethic Rubio has. Maybe he can add those things. It would be better for the league if he's able to, but you're banking a lot betting your pride on an unproven assumption :)
Also, Nash was already a good shooter at age 19 and Kidd was a good rebounder... just sayin'
He could be Jason Williams without any further development.
I will concede to mark & Justin's point that he needs more than a superior passing ability to get to the level of a Kidd or Nash. Kidd had rebounding and Nash has shooting. Can rebounding be learned...yes. Can shooting be learned...yes. I guess I'm assuming that Rubio will have people around him that will help him develop another key skill. He's 19 and I feel, with no improvement at all, he could be Tinsley. Rubio, in my mind, has a passing ability and court vision not seen in a long time. I'm banking on him adding a skill or two to that and becoming something great.
I've said this before, but I think Rubio's career path will be most like Jason Williams.
Joel :And you honestly think that if Rubio was on Santa Clara instead of Nash, he wouldn’t have ripped that league up even more? All you guys do is talk about shooting. Last I recalled, Morrison was a great shooter for Gonzaga before he came to the L. How’d his career turn out again?
PG's who can't shoot in today's league generally don't become stars. PG's who can't shoot and don't have elite athleticism, and it's almost unheard of depending on how you feel about Kidd's athleticism level.
You have to do more than pass to be a star PG in the NBA.
And like Mark said, there's nothing wrong with being a Tinsley-type of player. That's still a solid type of PG to have on your team, a very good starter. But comparing him to Nash or Kidd or Rondo who've made their bones and who all have skillsets better suited to NBA play is baseless, IMO.
As far as Adam Morrison goes, his career 3pt numbers at Gonzaga weren't great, and actually like Rubio he lacked some key skills at his position. Athleticism, defensive chops, passing ability, effective handles. He was a shooter, and not even super great at that if you look at his whole college resume and not his one great season.
Right now Rubio has the makings of an effective floor game and has some passing chops. That's not enough to be a star PG...
Joel :
My question is why do people wanna see Rubio not live up to the hype? Is it cause we passed on him and don’t wanna see that Presti made a mistake?
I don't want to see Rubio fail. I don't think we're doing the kid any favors by casually tossing out references to some of the best point guards of all time, like Rubio is somehow like them.
If Rubio becomes one of the best guards in history, it will be done in a different way than Kidd or Nash. Those two players are absolutely superlative at what they do. To be so benign about tossing out comparisons devalues what Kidd and Nash *have* done and what Rubio *could* do.
I also don't think it's a failure is Rubio only turns out to be a better Tinsley. Tinsley was a decent player hampered by injuries. Tinsley had a 3 year peak of 12.5 - 3.5 - 6.2; 1 year peak of 11.9 - 3.6 - 8.4. If Rubio ends up 13 - 3.5 - 8 for his 3 year peak and is able to be the second best player on whatever team he finally plays for, I wouldn't call that a busted pick.
Nash and Kidd were amazing in their primes and are still really, really good players. They were both capable of being the best player on their team. And both proved to be so in the playoffs.
And you honestly think that if Rubio was on Santa Clara instead of Nash, he wouldn't have ripped that league up even more? All you guys do is talk about shooting. Last I recalled, Morrison was a great shooter for Gonzaga before he came to the L. How'd his career turn out again?
@mark...How bout we bet that Rubio's first three seasons will be better than Nash's? As far as the Kidd bet...who said anything about money? I got none. My bets are always in terms of pride. Not that I have much of that either. Haha
Nullum :I love watching Durant and Westbrook play D at this tournament.
They've both been very solid defensively, I agree it's been nice to see.
@Bender
Alright, podomatic had problems updating the feed. I fixed it, iTunes should have it up shortly. Download it directly for now.
Oops, just checked. For some reason iTunes hasn't put the new episode up yet. We've sent it in and updated the feed two days ago. Not sure why it's taken this long.
@Bender
The new iTunes account works for the iphone. Or atleast that's what I've been told by multiple iPhone users.
Joel :@mark
. A career “anything like Jason Kidd’s”…done. Name the terms.
Jason Kidd:
Rookie of the Year
10x NBA All-Star
5x All-NBA First Team
9x All-Defensive Team (4x 1st Team)
5x Season Leader in Assists Per Game
4 Year Statistical Peak: 15.6 - 6.9 - 10.1
He's also the only player ever to have 15K Pts / 7K Reb / 10K Ast for his career, all-time leader for rebounds for a guard, 3rd all-time for triple doubles, and the best player on two conference champs with crappy teammates.
What % of those numbers do you think Rubio is going to hit?
80%? 8x All-Star, 4x First-Team & Assist Leader, 7x All-Defense?
This is why it's insane to say "I know Rubio has never played an NBA game, but he is destined to be like Kidd. In fact, I'm so certain of it, I think it's MORE LIKELY he turns out like Kidd than he doesn't. I would BET ON IT."
And I'm still laughing about "really getting down and dirty" and comparing Rubio to Nash. Did you even look at Nash's stats before you tossed that out? Nash has always been a good 3P shooter. How are those two similar?
Anyway, I'd be glad to take your money. How much?
I love watching Durant and Westbrook play D at this tournament.
Mark! :
I’m skeptical that will somehow be different in the pros where the guards are faster and more athletic. Rubio seems like a decent ball-handler, but I’m also skeptical he’ll be giving out as many assists as he has been in international play. There’s no reason not to smother him on defense. He doesn’t have the offensive chops to keep his defender honest.
Generally, assists increase from the European game to the NBA game. NBA scorekeepers are much more liberal with handing out assists than European scorekeepers. Further, the NBA tends to be more focused on singular players, giving ball dominant players much more opportunity. I think he's going to struggle in Minny where his teammates aren't that good and the offensive system has historically not been kind to PGs, but I think he'll be a very good player if he ever gets to play for a team with its act together.
Can we get IPhone compatibility please?
Joel :@mark. A career “anything like Jason Kidd’s”…done. Name the terms.
LOL I think you'll get some nice odds on that one. :)
@mark. A career "anything like Jason Kidd's"...done. Name the terms.
When Nash was in college, he lead his league in assists and scoring and shot 40% from 3P...
When he was 19, he averaged 15PPG w/ 40% from 3
I don't really see any reason to compare Rubio to Rondo. If Rubio is going to be something special, he'll be special in a way entirely different from Rondo because Rubio isn't anywhere near as athletic as Rondo is.
If you're ready to crown Rubio the next Jason Kidd, I'll take whatever bet you're willing to make that Rubio won't have a career anything like Kidd's. If I have to eat my words, I'll eat em. I think I'm safe though.
Jason Kidd at 19 vs present Rubio is not a stretch comparison. Rondo at 19 vs Rubio wouldn't even be fair. And if you really wanna get down and dirty, try Nash at 19 vs Rubio.
That's the biggest key here. The guy is so young and is starting for a Spanish team that many are calling the 2nd best basketball nation in the world at present. No one is saying Rubio doesn't have a steep learning curve comin into the NBA, but that he has some sick skill and shows as much potential as many of today's present stars did before they hit the L.
@Joel
It's because people are already saying things like this:
"Nick made a great comparison of Rubio to Rondo (minus a little athleticism and plus better play making ability.)"
Rajon Rondo is a top five assist man in the league and one of its best play makers. Jason Kidd is one of the best playmakers the NBA has seen since Magic and Stockton. Comparing Rubio to these guys is just silly, and the comparisons are only being made because Rondo and Kidd are practically the only two All Star PG's of the last decade that couldn't shoot. Bestowing these comparisons on Rubio before he's earned them is what creates the backlash against him.
Without elite athleticism or a consistent long range jumper, Rubio is a lot more like Jamaal Tinsley than Jason Kidd or Rajon Rondo. I think the Rubio heads are seriously under estimating NBA defenses and how they would affect a guy with Rubio's limitations. I think you have to go back and watch a little more young Jason Kidd.
Nick made a great comparison of Rubio to Rondo (minus a little athleticism and plus better play making ability.)
Passes and shoots like Kidd in my opinion. These are great comparisons.
My question is why do people wanna see Rubio not live up to the hype? Is it cause we passed on him and don't wanna see that Presti made a mistake?
@Mark!
Tinsley.
I think it works one way and not the other.
If someone breaks out and plays amazing in international play, there's no guarantee those skills will translate to the NBA. Maybe they will, maybe they won't.
But Rubio can't shoot and isn't fast enough or athletic enough to score inside against guards. That's been the story in this tournament as well.
I'm skeptical that will somehow be different in the pros where the guards are faster and more athletic. Rubio seems like a decent ball-handler, but I'm also skeptical he'll be giving out as many assists as he has been in international play. There's no reason not to smother him on defense. He doesn't have the offensive chops to keep his defender honest.
Take Rondo and remove his athleticism... what are you left with?
Can we really tell how good he's gonna be by international ball? Won't the NBA be a errrr stage for him?
Will the Rubio hype machine survive the FIBA Championship?
29 minutes, 3:2 A:T, 6 Pts (0/2 3P) – France
26 minutes, 11:4 A:T, 8 Pts (0/2 3P) – New Zealand
28 minutes, 2:2 A:T, 3 Pts (0/1 3P) – Lithuania
26 minutes, 7:0 A:T, 0 Pts (0/2 3P) – Lebanon
25 minutes, 8:1 A:T, 8 Pts (1/4 3P) – Canada
27 minutes, 6:1 A:T, 6 Pts (0/2 3P) - Greece
—————————————
161 minutes, 37:10 A:T, 31 Pts (1/13 3P)