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Raymond Felton says Russell Westbrook isn’t a team player

by Royce Young on January 4, 2012 at 3:36 pm 196 Comments

Layne Murdoch/NBAE/Getty Images

There’s not a ton of history between Raymond Felton and Russell Westbrook, but enough I guess for Felton to feel the need to basically call Westbrook out.

Westbrook was hyper-energetic on the defensive end last night guarding Felton, really trying to swipe at the ball and cause havoc. It had mixed results with Westbrook sometimes creating good pressure and turnovers, but other times he gambled too much and forced OKC’s defense to collapse and rotate after Felton got by him. It obviously didn’t work enough as Portland beat the Thunder 103-93 with Felton putting up 12 points and seven assists.

Felton noticed this. And I guess he took it somewhat personally, essentially calling Westbrook out for not being a team player. Via Jason Quick of the Oregonian:

“That’s the type of guy he is, that’s his mindset, that’s how he plays,” Felton said when I remarked about Westbrook’s win-the-battle, but lose-the-war mentality. “He’s always in a one-on-one battle with all the point guards. I’m not really into that. I’m into winning. If you win, everybody gets the praises. We are not wearing ‘Felton’ on the front of our jerseys; it says Blazers. I care about the Blazers winning.”

I think we can all read between the lines there. Felton is essentially saying that Westbrook only cares about showing up the man across from him, not that his Thunder win the game.

Having watched Westbrook for three full seasons though, I’d say that’s entirely unfair. There isn’t anyone on the roster — not even Kevin Durant — that cares about winning as much as Westbrook. He almost cares too much, which is why his over-aggressive style can be seen as selfish sometimes. Westbrook has always had a chip on his shoulder and has always wanted to prove people wrong.

Scott Brooks made a point to single Westbrook’s performance out last night though.

“I thought Russell had one of his best games,” he said. “He left everything on the court. He made plays for us. He was moving the ball. He was defending.”

Felton saw that as being selfish though. Which I think is just a mis-read of how Westbrook plays. Because Russ has gotten heated with a lot of other point guards — Chris Paul, Kyle Lowry, Deron Williams, Derek Fisher and basically 25 others who happen to be opposing him on any given night. Westbrook plays emotional and approaches each game as a challenge to beat the man across from him. I think he sees it as if he can do that, his team will win.

And in most cases, it’s true. But that’s part of what the NBA is — one-on-one battles. Games within games. Kobe wants to humiliate the defender trying to check him. Same with KD. It’s how they approach it. Does that mean they’re selfish? Some certainly would think Kobe is at times but his main objective is winning. Felton is suggesting that winning the game comes second behind winning the individual matchup.

Felton and Westbrook did battle out it in the playoffs last season with Felton’s Nuggets falling to the Thunder in five games. Felton had a front row seat to the beginning of the supposed ball-hog noise following Westbrook that really started with Game 4 in Denver where Westbrook took 30 shots. But at the same time, Westbrook’s Thunder handled Denver fairly easily in a gentleman’s sweep en route to the Western Conference Finals.

This is the type of thing you can be sure Westbrook has heard and will think about when the Blazers play the Thunder again. It probably isn’t all that tough to get into Westbrook’s head so it could be a little psychological warfare on Russ. Which isn’t a bad move by Felton considering the events surrounding Westbrook the past few days.

Tuesday night, Felton got the better of Westbrook by playing a calm, measured point compared to Westbrook’s frenzied, aggressive one. Felton’s team won the game. We’ll see what happens next time.

Via Thunder Rumblings

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Keith00
Keith00 5pts

I agree that Westbrook wants to win as badly or worse than anyone on the team. But lack of desire has never been a gripe about him. My problem is that I don't think he actually knows the difference between winning and losing basketball. Every time an obstacle presents itself, he goes all Scott Brooks and just "tries harder." I think that's what Hero-mode Russ is. He sees a problem and assumes he can fix it just by running faster, being more aggressive, and doing it himself. He believes in his coach, and in this instance his coach failed him. Especially as a PG, you can't solve every problem by taking over the offense and gambling for steals on defense.

It's like he was never taught that playing harder is NOT the same as playing smarter, or that playing smarter is the path to winning basketball. Perhaps with a coach that taught him better, Westbrook would be a different player, perhaps not. As it is, we have a PG with a mediocre bball IQ that only seems to get worse when adversity strikes. His immense talent can overcome the drop in playing smart, which is why he is still a great player. But, there MUST be a change coming. Either Brooks needs to impress upon Russ what it really means to be a winner, or we need a coach who can. If Brooks IS trying to get Russ to play smarter, but Russ goes Hero instead, we need to make a trade for a PG that can fit.

TaoMaas
TaoMaas 5pts

@Keith00 Dude! Your hate for Brooks is overwhelming your logic! Brooks isn't the first coach Russ has had.

Keith00
Keith00 5pts like.author.displayName 1 Like

@TaoMaas I fail to see your point there. We fired Carlesimo because he was a bad coach - so to put any stock in the few months he had Russ seems silly. Brooks has had two full years now, and Westbrook's tendencies haven't changed much. His effectiveness in certain areas has improved, but he still plays pretty much the same way. And like I said, I've never questioned his desire or his talent - he has them in spades. What I question is his decision making (which has not improved much). If that is all him, then I admit we should explore trades. If not, then we need to explore coaching options. That's not hate, that's logic.

And as for my hate of Brooks, all my opinions extend only from my desire to see the team succeed. LA would run Brooks out of town if he tried the same system we have now over there. San Antonio wouldn't have won one championship, much less 4, with a ball-stopping offense and unmotivated defense. Coaching is about putting your team in the best position to succeed, then hoping the players do their job. Brooks has consistently done the opposite (Jeff Green, Thabo starting, "giving up" lineups in the 4th, exacerbating problems - going small when we can't defend or rebound). Just look at our rotations, the time given to bad lineups, and try to conclude that Brooks is putting our best foot forward rather than relying completely on out-talenting the opposition.

Keith00
Keith00 5pts

@TaoMaas I don't really have any way of knowing. I've never been to a practice. Both Brooks and Cheeks were PGs, so I would guess both have input. But, if you're asking who is ultimately responsible for the development of the team (and Russ specifically), it's Brooks. That's the cost of being head coach. If Brooks doesn't think Cheeks is getting the job done, the onus is on him to find someone who can (Orlando had at least two former stars come in just to coach Dwight). If Brooks doesn't see a problem, then he's not a very good coach.

TaoMaas
TaoMaas 5pts

@Keith00 Okay...let's talk specifically about the Thunder. Who do you think coaches the point guards more...Brooks or Cheeks?

Keith00
Keith00 5pts

@TaoMaas And he didn't play PG until the pros, so the most important coaching experience for him on THIS team is Brooks. I can't fault his high school or college coaches for teaching him to score - they were playing him at SG. I CAN question whether Brooks is the right man for the job of turning him into a high IQ PG when Russ has shown very little decision making improvement in the last 3 years. He still relies on shots he can't make (pretty much everything mid-range), still will freeze out the rest of the team when down a few points, and commits a lot of bad turnovers.

You have to understand, I'm not saying this because I hate Russ or Brooks (though I don't think he is a good coach). I say this because two things are true for each person. Russ either can or cannot learn to be a smarter player and PG. Brooks either can or cannot teach Russ how to do that. If either answer is "cannot," then that individual needs to be moved. I'm not even making a specific claim about what those answers are - merely pointing out the evidence that suggest Brooks is closer to "cannot."

TaoMaas
TaoMaas 5pts

@Keith00 How long do you think Russ has been playing basketball? He has to have had coaches in grade school, jr. high, high school, college, and now two coaches (not counting assistants) in the pros. That's my point.

MrRaysian
MrRaysian 5pts

anyone else notice how James Harden is in the Forwards list in the all star ballot? should probably fix that up

DPC
DPC 5pts

@MrRaysian I just sent an email through NBA.com about the issue

DizzDai
DizzDai 5pts

I agree with Felton more than Brooks. Russ was gambling way too often and that left our defense out of wack. The only thing I disagree with Felton's statement is that RW only cares about showing his man up. I think Russ plays to win.

ILikePancakes
ILikePancakes 5pts like.author.displayName like.author.displayName 2 Like

Every year with Brooks as a coach= one unproductive year with such amount of talent in OKC.

Tronchaser
Tronchaser 5pts

@ILikePancakes I wouldn't call getting to the WCF as unproductive, but yeah, I get what ya mean.

dollarbillrussell
dollarbillrussell 5pts

@Tronchaser @ILikePancakes I would say every year from here on out. I really don't see us getting out of the western conference with Brooks as the coach, regardless of how many regular season games we're able to win. The playoffs are an entirely different beast, and will expose Brooks 'play hard, pass the ball's coaching style.

JeremyBrewer
JeremyBrewer 5pts

Felton isn't the most handsome lad there ever was. That is all.

Tronchaser
Tronchaser 5pts

@JeremyBrewer I've always thought of Raymond Felton as a bowling ball. That is all.

yunghawg
yunghawg 5pts

@Tronchaser@JeremyBrewer a squishy bowling ball

JeremyBrewer
JeremyBrewer 5pts

@yunghawg@Tronchaser with tiny, beady little eyes.

Stephen Jackson is not about this spelling
Stephen Jackson is not about this spelling 5pts like.author.displayName like.author.displayName like.author.displayName 3 Like

As entertaining as creating hypothetical trades may be, It would be incredibly foolish to part with one of the leaders of our immensely talented team without first attempting a coaching change. Until that point, calling for a trade of our all-nba point guard (or any of our main guys) is silly.

On another note, am I the only one who has a gut feeling that the spurs are going to end up acquiring Demarcus cousins, having timmy mentor him, and letting the big-man lineage continue?

Old Man Game
Old Man Game 5pts

It irritates me how many games are on NBA TV. I got league pass broadband so I could follow lob city and now they're on NBA TV and there's no way to watch it. If I had it with cable of course it would come with NBA TV. They are really screwing people who opted for the online only option.

Crow
Crow 5pts

Pleiss averaging about 8 pts, 5 rebs, 1 block in 18 minutes per game in the euroleague with 50% FG% and about 70% FT%. thats pretty good. don't know about the defense.

f5alcon
f5alcon 5pts

@Crow the rebounding numbers should translate to over here, but the points are harder to judge, rubio is scoring much better here.

Crow
Crow 5pts

@f5alcon@Crow yeah

shiki
shiki 5pts

Latavious Williams plays better and better in ACB,I hope he will play summer league

Crow
Crow 5pts

@shiki Latavious Williams 9 pts 6.5 rebs. 0.6 blocks in 24 minutes in ACB. FG% and FT% about the same as Pleiss.

shiki
shiki 5pts

@Crow He is the 8th in rebound rank and 45% of his rebs are offense rebs.That is very great.But in ACB site he is only 6'8''.It is decent If it is without shoes

Lambchop
Lambchop 5pts

@shiki I keep wondering about this guy

Crow
Crow 5pts

Thunder defensive efficiency currently well below average due to bottom 10 (or even bottom 3) rankings on 3 Factors. Tough schedule in part of it though.

Mullens well above average FG% from every distance except at the rim (and 3 pt).

White well above average from every distance except 3 pt.

But same is basically true for Collison and Mohammed. The few shots they get / take.

OkcBaby
OkcBaby 5pts

Thabo come back soon! DailyThunderers losing their minds.

Tronchaser
Tronchaser 5pts

@OkcBaby Watch, Thabo comes back, we start winning again. Mere coincidence?

Daniel Hawaii
Daniel Hawaii 5pts

@Tronchaser@OkcBaby If we do start winning again, I think it has less to do with Thabo, and more to do with our rotations going back to normal.

[censored]
[censored] 5pts

@Tronchaser@OkcBaby ...Yes.

thunderstruck87
thunderstruck87 5pts

@Tronchaser @[censored] @OkcBaby they will win a few games and even though he isn't up for an extention Brooks is going to give Thabo a max offer haha

Tronchaser
Tronchaser 5pts like.author.displayName 1 Like

@[censored]@OkcBaby Exactly. But you KNOW Scotty won't see it that way.

Lambchop
Lambchop 5pts

I proposed earlier a Westbrook (Whom I love) for Marcus Thornton and Fredette earlier, which was universally shot down. Would you trade RW fro Eric Gordon and someone else? Eric Gordon has a far superior reputation, but someone please explain to me how Gordon is better than Thornton

moriarty84
moriarty84 5pts

@Lambchop No to everything.

LPCes99
LPCes99 5pts

@moriarty84 @Daniel Plainview more like HELL NO...Thornton is similar to Ben gordon (undersized 2 guard)...overrated and over paid...doesn't do anything else...perfect bench scorer

shiki
shiki 5pts

@Lambchop Why do you want to trade a PG for a SG which we dont need?I think none of those players you mention can play PG

Lambchop
Lambchop 5pts

@shiki Im not of the thought we have to replace RW. Maynor can start and if Reggie is not ready, Harden could easily make the transition. Thronton might be the most underrated player in the league so wed be buying low. The man already has a 42 pt and a 37 pt game to his credit and his pt avg, FG % and 3pt% are equivalent

Lambchop
Lambchop 5pts

@shiki He is a SG so selfish is kinda their thing. I dont think hed try to take games out of KDs hands, plus even if we do sign Russ to a non-max, it would still be significantly more than that. I would love to add anotehr perimeter scorer who can nail the three and get to the rim

shiki
shiki 5pts

@Lambchop Many Kings fans think he is selfish and cannot play well with Evans.I know many of them are bias but his assist is very low.And $32M/4 yrs is not cheap for him

Lambchop
Lambchop 5pts

@shiki http://espn.go.com/nba/player/stats/_/id/4017/marcus-thornton

Thunder S
Thunder S 5pts

the northwest division is just going to be crazy this year

Thunder S
Thunder S 5pts like.author.displayName like.author.displayName 2 Like

in other news, ricky rubio is a freaking passing savant

DizzDai
DizzDai 5pts like.author.displayName 1 Like

@Thunder S I think the draft class of 2009 is going to win ROY three years straight.

kfmsooner
kfmsooner 5pts

We are talking about trading Westbrook like it is acceptable. A good thing to do. Reasonable. But when a poster brings up firing Scott Brooks, people go bonkers. I'd much rather extend Westbrook, fire Brooks, hire someone who has a clue, and run a real offense. Oh, and redo the trades for DJ White and Byron Mullens...

[censored]
[censored] 5pts like.author.displayName 1 Like

@kfmsooner I think we're all being slightly reactionary. Even though they started 5-0, I don't think even then the team was performing up to expectations. Our expected W-L after those five games was 3-2, we were very lucky to win against Dallas and Minnesota. I think overall they've played like a 4-5 seed like they were over the course of last season, when it's been expected that the Thunder will win the West. Last season to start the year Kevin Durant was struggling bad and there were posts here and elsewhere questioning whether Russell Westbrook is better than him.

There are huge, legitimate concerns. The rebounding and defense especially, things that were supposed to be fixed, have not been good. Russell's ballooning USG and struggles from the field is concerning. Brooks surmising that the defense was good against Portland is concerning. But the season isn't over yet, and if there's anyone in this organization I think will make good decisions over the long run it's Presti. I'm pretty confident that if the team doesn't perform to expectations or take another step forward, Presti will do something to ensure it happens.

Lambchop
Lambchop 5pts

@[censored]@kfmsooner KD got off to bad starts his last three seasons, but it wasnt really his decision making that was in question. But i do remember people on here suggesting that RW might be better. Wow, how things gave changed in a year. Im still on the trade RW wagon because 1) I think he wants to go elsewhere, and 2) his style is not fit for our team chemisry

Tronchaser
Tronchaser 5pts like.author.displayName 1 Like

@[censored]@kfmsooner Justin the optimist?

/shocked

finish1ine
finish1ine 5pts like.author.displayName 1 Like

@kfmsooner I don't think X's and O's are a problem. It has more to do with our starting lineup has 5 players who are average to below average passers. Our 2nd unit does a fine job scoring and moving the ball, and they get the same coaching.

We need Westbrook and Durant to alter their game to take that next step.

TaoMaas
TaoMaas 5pts

@finish1ine I think your point about the 2nd unit getting the same coaching as the 1st team is very astutue. I mentioned something yesterday that Maynor had said in his pre-game interview before the Blazers game about the Thunder going one-on-one too much. The way he said it seemed to indicate that the players who kept going one-on-one (KD...Russ...I'm talking to you!) weren't doing what the coaches asked of them. We like to blame Brooks for the offense's problems, but what if it's KD and Russ who keep thinking, "I can take this guy" or "I can make this"...and blow off the game plan? Many times, they're right. They CAN take that guy or make that shot...but if we want to play the percentages, the smart move is to make a few more passes and look for something better. Too many times, we shoot without making a single pass or, at best, one pass.

Trackbacks

  1. Thunder start fast and finish strong against Portland, 111-95 | Daily Thunder.com says:
    March 19, 2012 at 12:14 am

    [...] Felton and Russell Westbrook. The two very obviously don’t have fond feelings for each other, especially after Felton called Westbrook out. It was clear the two were kind of taking the matchup personally, but I thought Westbrook did an [...]

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