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Kevin Durant is making a strong MVP push. He’s gaining in the polls (leading in one crucial one), dominated LeBron in that debate the other night and is rising in popularity with the middle class.
And now, he’s just picked up a critical endorsement from the incumbent. Derrick Rose says KD is his MVP right now. Via ESPN Chicago:
“KD is playing great,” Rose said. “I’m hearing about what he’s doing, hearing about how he’s playing. The numbers speak for itself, how he’s working out this summer, and he’s playing great basketball.
“(Minnesota’s Kevin Love) K-Love been putting in work, too, but I think KD.”
Durant’s candidacy includes 27.7 points per game (second in the league), a career-high 50.1 percent from the field, a PER of 26.63 (third in the league), a career-high 3.5 assists per game, a career-high 8.1 rebounds per game, the best record in the West, a 1-0 record against LeBron and a 2-0 record against Kobe. Oh, and he’s the leader in virtually every clutch stat there is.
Rose’s endorsement though is actually pretty important. Because one of the biggest steps in winning the award is creating the overwhelming buzz of media and fans. You have to get it to the point where it seems like you’re an idiot if you don’t think Durant’s the MVP.
That’s where LeBron had things a month ago. But because of KD’s outstanding consistent play and his takedown of LeBron head-to-head, he’s started to pull in a good number of swing voters. He’s got the media buzzing his way, he’s got the chatter in his pocket. He’s leading “MVP Watch” columns, gaining steam in (Heat) red states while still stockpiling support in (Thunder) blue states.
Rose is iffy Sunday against OKC, but that’s another national broadcast that Durant can make a statement in. And after that, he’s got another showdown with LeBron. If KD can duplicate a similar performance again against LeBron, this thing might not even have to go to the convention. Durant might just wrap the nomination up right then and there.
Kobe Bryant leads Kevin Durant by 26 points in scoring this season on 198 more FGA, and 37 more FTA's.
Okay, I did some thinking about this last night and here is a big problem with the standard stats:
if we are going to assign value to an assist then we have to devalue an assisted basket by an equal amount. i.e. on a single play
unassisted basket = assist + assisted basket
Let me give you a hypothetical situation. Imagine a 2 on 2 game where one team scores 5 baskets with all 5 assisted, the other team scores 6 baskets with zero assists. The way we analyze stats, here is how we would compare the stat lines of the teams
team 1 - 10 pts - 5 assists
team 2 - 12 pts - 0 assists
Clearly, team 2 won the game and PLAYED better. If our model says that team 1 was more efficient and therefore better then our model is wrong. According to stat guru's team 1 has a better stat line therefore the stat guru's model is wrong. If we look at these two stat lines, the difference between them aren't too different than Lebron and KD's. KD is a significantly better isolation scorer than Lebron, I don't think anyone would disagree with that statement. KD is 3rd in the league in isolation buckets, don't know what Lebron is. The way the stat guru's are calculating efficiency devalue's isolation scoring and/or over values assists and assisted scoring. What are your thoughts?
Who are the people that decide the MVP? and what are the specific criteria for the award?Depending on those two things, Durant has a chance on getting it this season
I just want you ALL to know that no matter how much you guys disagree about who should win what, stats, and ect. ect. ect. It is really REALLY DRAMATICALLY AWESOME that we are even having such intelligent disscussions i mean honestly thats the reason why i fell in love with this board to begin with because there are some very smart posters in this joint. I've been around different boards, and no other board honestly has posters as intelligent, as creative, as knowledgable on basketball fundlementals, and most importantly funny as this one.
I SALUTE YOU ALL!!! Seriously, this stuff is some good read, and who ever found this board, and read any of this stuff's material, they're basketball IQ would go up by the 100's. I think we need to get the Guys from the Animal, and Skip in here and make them do their homework!!
Royce does a very solid job on here. I'm very discerning in what I read--and I always find myself nodding as I go through his post-game recap. Very solid. There are some excellent posters on here as well who genuinely understand hoops. I would guess the guys at the Animal are already going through this site form time to time to sharpen their game and overall NBA acumen. They need to--seriously. Skip Bayless isn't a journalist anymore, but rather just an ESPN performer who is scripted to play out a part and create ratings. I ignore the Litttle ESPN Ferret.
@ElMexiThunder 5 greatest basketball players of all time:
1. BEARD
2. BEARD
3. BEARD
4. jordan?
5. BEARD
@persiansooner13
How could anyone argue with that!!
@ElMexiThunder @persiansooner13 Bill Russell has a pretty epic beard. Is he one of the Beards above?
Don Nelson is going to go into the Hall of Fame, reports CSNBayArea.com.
The announcement will be made official Monday, but Nelson confirmed he got the call Wednesday morning to ESPN.
http://probasketballtalk.nbcsports.com/2012/03/29/don-nelson-finally-elected-to-the-hall-of-fame/related/
Mo Cheeks too
http://probasketballtalk.nbcsports.com/2012/02/24/reggie-miller-don-nelson-and-bernard-king-among-2012-hall-of-fame-candidates/
oops. that second was candidates list. I was looking for announcements of who got in.
@ThunderChick2010 dang
I think Cheeks announced that he wasn't selected. . . .
"Rebound with your heart" http://i173.photobucket.com/albums/w51/theguardianofdestiny/rebound.jpg
We should probably stop pretending that the MVP award is about the best player, right? Otherwise LeBron would still be at the top if you're going who's been the best player per minute of the NBA season. A couple of bad weeks doesn't undo how he was better than KD for the first months, but it's not the narrative anymore. Also KD hitting the big shots is something he does have on LeBron, but too much importance is placed on that because again, it's a nice narrative.
MVP isn't a best player award, if that was the case it wouldn't be the media voting. That makes no sense. The media want a narrative, so why wouldn't they vote for the best narrative? The story is more important than actual reality for them. That's their job, but it's taking away from the legitimacy of the MVP being a way of decisively saying who was the best player of a season.
@JamesChurch This has been a problem with the MVP award for years now. Part of it is the term 'valuable', which lends itself to all manner of interpretations. If it were called the 'Best Player Award', then it would remove some ambiguity from the term, although you would naturally still have debates about who was the best.
For what it's worth, I think it wouldn't be ridiculous if KD won this year. Yes Lebron's stats are sick, but so are KD's, and KD's late game performances might well be enough justification for him to edge James. It all depends on what you prefer to place emphasis on.
@JBDW I don't think it's the valuable that's the problem, I think it's the way it's decided. The media is allowed to write it's own MVP story with a few ingredients given. I'm sure there's a better way of working it out. An MVP panel or something.
@JamesChurch The media voting on it is a major issue for sure, but I do think the ambiguity does play a pretty big role. Going on any sports forums, you'll see a ton of people arguing over the MVP each year, each of them having different criteria because of their interpretation of 'valuable'.
@JamesChurch While true, as hoop heads, it's our duty to argue over who's stats could beat up everyone else's
@FREE_COLE That was fun last year, but KD and LeBron are so similar this year. LeBron does a little more, KD's come up big at the end of a bunch of games and beat LeBron in their head to head. That's all there is to it really. At least last year we had narrative vs. stats for real. KD's stats are still so good it isn't about that now. It's basically personal preference. Do you want a bit more efficiency, or do you want that perceived clutch that KD has?
@FREE_COLE @JamesChurch @FF_pickups agreed on dwight last year
@FREE_COLE @FF_pickups Yeah but they still bounced in the first round. Not to mention Dwight's a late game liability, STILL.
@JamesChurch @FF_pickups I never thought it was ok. I actually thought Dwight deserved it. Without him anchoring that team, they'd be a bunch of scrubs who average 80ish points a game. With dwight being very un dwightlike this year, that seems more and more clear
@FF_pickups @FREE_COLE We laugh at Rose's MVP now, but at the time it seemed... Okay. Because he IS that valuable to his team, and it showed them he got shut down in the playoffs. The Bulls can win as many regular season games as they want, but without Rose they can't pull it off in the playoffs. Now they're better as a unit than last year, so Rose might be a little more free because he's not the only cog in the offense. I agree that if either LeBron or KD outperforms the other by a significant margin then it's done. If it's a wash I have no clue. It'll be whoever the media decides on I'd say.
@FREE_COLE Yeah man I know, but it honestly does feel like our duty to scream over the MVP for at least a day.
@FREE_COLE @JamesChurch
lol, true dat. And don't get me wrong, last year Rose winning was a complete joke. Lebron should have won. And I had been on the Lebron bandwagon the entire season until Lebron had 5 bad games in a row AND got dominated by the Durant on national TV. In my mind, those two things together made this back into a race. And I would be shocked if the winner of the Wednesday game doesn't win the MVP.
@JamesChurch My comment was mostly tongue in cheek about the fact that FF_pickups and I have been arguin this all night. Just a bad joke
Portland choked that away.
What are russ's chances of being named to the Olympic team now that this season is playing out? Conventional wisdom a month or two ago was he might be on outside looking in with cp3 & rose being the supposed pg locks, with d-will being the likely 3rd due in part to his more 'traditional' pg skills.
@Wanderer
I know that I am totally biased but I believe in RW. During the tryouts for the WC, nobody thought he was making the team. Not only did he make it, he was playing crunch time and I think he was the second leading scorer on the team, definitely ahead of DRose. Now, I'm not saying that this guarantees that he's on, what I am saying is that he'll be given a fair chance to make the team and I truly believe that he's a superior player to Deron Williams and therefore I think he'll make the team. I hope that I am right because Olympic basketball is about as good as it gets and if we have both Thunder reps there, that'll be the best. I am already dreading having to cheer against Serge in the gold medal round.
I wouldn't be opposed to taking all 4 of them, leave Kobe off, & play Russ at sg. I can see a bunch of 3 for 15's from Kobe cause he doesn't realize he's half the player he once was & no one will get in his face about it since he's a legend. On the other hand, okc's got this year and next year to win a championship until we can no longer afford harden +/ or ibaka so wouldn't bother me if neither Russ or kd played in the Olympics in order to keep them healthy & fresh.
@jdstorm @FF_pickups Think I'd go 1st team - cp3, d wade, Lebron, love, Dwight. 2nd - d-will, rose, melo, Lma, Bynum. Alternates - Josh Smith & Blake. At home, recuperating by the pool, watching on tv - kd, Russ, beard & ibaka.
@Wanderer @FF_pickups Im not sure if KD will start. My personal USA starting lineup would be Rose Beard Lebron KD Dwight though you could argue a better balanced lineup might be
PG CP3 SG Kobe SF Lebron PF Love C dwight. then have Rose Russ Cermelo and KD as the second unit with bynum as C
@FF_pickups No guarantee that kd will even start. Melo has a reputation as a terrific international player and I gotta believe coach k will acquiesce to him & all the 08 guys. I'm all for USA bball but I care a helluva lot more about thunder bball.
@Wanderer
I'm sorry but I disagree. I LOVE the Olympics. I have a feeling that this is going to be KD's team, too. In the All Star Game, KD didn't acquiesce to Kobe and by then, maybe Kobe's even worse than he is now. KD's winning like 4 gold medals before it's all said and done.
Here's two more "I don't want to take the last shot" video's from Lebron
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MUK6mwGLGBY
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=89XqDgD-M_E
Blazers are going to win this....
@JooseppiHoles in the Clipper game are enlarging by the minute
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@PlusMinusGod You must have sado-masochistic tendencies is all I can glean if you watch Skip Bayless. i went ahead and gave you a mercy like just because you were honest enough on the internet to admit you watched and listened to Skip Bayless. You're better than this.
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@PlusMinusGod @El Prez
Come on guys, that was high comedy. He was so funny today. He will not back down even though it's painfully obvious to everyone that RW has become a superstar. The funny thing is with Skip, he just as easily could have taken the narrative 3 years ago that KD was the gunner and that RW was the better talent and if he had, he would be supporting RW like he was Tim Tebow. But he's hilarious if you just take him as a cartoon character. I can not wait til we win the championship. It is going to be the best when Stephen A. Smith goes on there and lights him up like a christmas tree.
@PlusMinusGod
I heard the same thing. I was thinking exactly the same thing.
I know JJ Hickson is not as good as his recent performances would suggest, but I have a really hard time believing he couldn't even sit on the bench at Sacramento.
@Jooseppi They like to play as many trigger happy guards at once as possible.
Dallas wins, Utah loses, Denver wins, Houston beats Memphis. As bad as the Clippers are they should win. I have a feeling I'm going to be shocked in some way when this playoff picture pans out.
@Jooseppi The Clips are actually allowing Portland to hang around. Of course anyone can beat anyone in the NBA but give me a break. Portland is decimated by trades/injury. You need to be able to stomp them down in the dirt and have garbage time by midway through the 3d if not earlier.
@Old Man Game Especially at home.
ESPN 3 is a great service but why the heck do they run the same 3-4 commercials everytime? I know this isn't primo advertising space but geez, I'd rather see someone selling shamwows occasionally than have to sit through these damn Red Stag "dudes talking sports" deals 20 times a game.
@Old Man Game Different ad sales for online broadcasts. Don't want to give the milk away for free and not a lot of sponsors likely wanting to pay ESPN's price, as well as people being slow to adapt.
@Jooseppi .Totally off topic, what is that a picture of in your avatar? Just curious.
@Jooseppi @Old Man Game In its small form on my screen, I thought it was an angel of some sort. Boy was I wrong. :)
@Jooseppi Okay. I see it now. It looked like he was in a hot tub in the smaller picture with the steam/smoke and all.
@Old Man Game Yeah. Sorry. http://livefyre-avatar.s3.amazonaws.com/a/1/a88cf1801d875e426fe47f7ead9c7390/orig.jpg
@Jooseppi Is it a fat old guy?
@Old Man Game Some dude I found on Google images. I had a Harden avatar for a year or so and wanted to make a change so I googled Jooseppi.