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Report: Magic and Thunder have discussed Dwight Howard deal

by Royce Young on March 9, 2012 at 12:19 pm 314 Comments

Kevin C. Cox/NBAE/Getty Images

Per Brian Schmitz of the Orlando Sentinel: “Magic have talked to OKC but Thunder balks at giving up Ibaka and Harden to rent Dwight.”

Chew on that for a second.

Trade James Harden and Serge Ibaka to have Dwight Howard for two months and the playoffs. And then realize this: The Thunder giving up any player, much less Harden and Ibaka to rent Howard pretty much goes against the entire organization’s philosophy. Everything Sam Presti has done has been centered around the idea of long-term, sustained success. It’s been a plan of bringing in players that can grow, learn, mature and evolve together into a team that will be successful for the next 10 years.

But… but. Russell Westbrook, Thabo Sefolosha, Kevin Durant, Nick Collison and Dwight Howard. Not a bad look, eh? A lot of people say that would put OKC in the driver’s seat to win a title now. And it probably would. But who says they aren’t already there? We’re all frantically searching for flaws in this team, but 31-8 and still improving tells me this group is certainly the conversation for a championship. Will they win it? No guarantees. But the same goes for a Westbrook-KD-Howard trio.

And that’s the thing. Say the Thunder made the trade and brought Howard to town. And say he even re-signs with OKC. If that group never won a title, wouldn’t you wonder about what the Thunder gave up? Wouldn’t it drive you crazy thinking about if OKC had stood its ground and believed in the plan, if that was good enough already? I know I would.

Plus, I’m kind of partial to Harden. That’s part of it. I really like the guy. I like what he represents, I like his game, I like his approach, I like his mentality. I think having him makes the Durant-Westbrook relationship better. Mix a potentially hazardous chemical like Dwight Howard to it and I fear we might get something toxic.

Then there’s the point that Thunder might be renting Harden and Ibaka for the next 14 months anyway. True. But that’s under the assumption that Clay Bennett is morally opposed to breaking into the luxury tax and that’s under the assumption that Presti can’t finagle around and find a way to make it happen (i.e. amnestying Perk, etc.).

(Relevant note: I would put the percentage chance of a deal happening involving Howard and the Thunder somewhere between Kate Upton proposing to me tonight and Presti giving me a 10-day contract. So it’s really all in just fun speculation.)

(Relevant note, part two: This is of course operating under the assumption it would be a rental for Howard. If he’s willing to re-sign long-term, well, that certainly changes things.)

Dan Shanoff and I were gchatting and he said it really well. Flags fly forever. The Mavericks are going to enjoy their title for the rest of time. And if acquiring Howard meant the Thunder would win a championship, that’s what you do. You play to win that trophy and you win them one at a time. Of course you want to win them on your own terms and there would be something a little sweeter in doing it with this core that was built through the draft and with shrewd cap management, but at the end of the day, it’s about raising a banner. If you could guarantee adding Howard does that, I don’t see any way around it. You do it.

But that’s the problem. There aren’t any guarantees in sports. None. You can’t know. There’s no Gray’s Sports Almanac to tell us. You make informed decisions on what you think is best and go from there. I believe this team right here is good enough to win the whole thing. And I kind of want to see them try.

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Crow
Crow 5pts

I haven't look at it the Howard talk closely because I can't convince myself it is serious or accurate.

ElMexiThunder
ElMexiThunder 5pts

Time for the gossip to be moved to the Pre-Game! SEE YA THERE!!

Fezzy
Fezzy 5pts

 @ElMexiThunder http://www.dailythunder.com/2012/03/cavaliers-vs-thunder-pregame-primer-3/

courtsense
courtsense 5pts

By all accounts, OKC rejected a Howard deal that involved Harden. Can we agree to stop debating whether Harden should be traded. He won't be, at least not for Howard. Presti may have said no to that to see if Otis Smith would then say, "well, what about Westbrook?"    

lmp5336
lmp5336 5pts like.author.displayName 1 Like

 @courtsense It was rejected because Dwight won't resign here. If he would, I imagine that Presti would pull the trigger in a heartbeat

courtsense
courtsense 5pts like.author.displayName 1 Like

 @lmp5336 We don't know exactly why it was rejected. Surely there is a price at which Presti would take his chances with Howard...it's just not Harden + Ibaka.

lmp5336
lmp5336 5pts

 @courtsense That's fair. That would be quite the steep price for a rental

ElMexiThunder
ElMexiThunder 5pts like.author.displayName 1 Like

 @courtsense  @lmp5336

 I'de much rather do Westbrook + Ibaka before i do Harden + Ibaka.

ElMexiThunder
ElMexiThunder 5pts

 @lmp5336  @courtsense

 Yeah but hey we all had fun dreaming it up, and doing all these scenerios.

lmp5336
lmp5336 5pts

 @ElMexiThunder  @courtsense Haha oh yeah absolutely. I'm still dreaming of Harden/Dwight pick and rolls

[censored]
[censored] 5pts

James Harden is the best PnR scorer in the NBA.  There are better distributors on PnR (i..e Nash) but Harden is 3rd in the whole NBA in PPP on PnR on a whole boat load of attempts (174).  He's number one in PPP on hand offs and off screen, getting one of those attempts each a game.  He's sixth in PPP on isolations.  Harden's only offensive 'weakness' scoring the ball is spot up, where he's at an even 1.0 PPP.  He's really having an incredible season offensively, I wish we could see him with higher usage.

lmp5336
lmp5336 5pts

 @justin_mia Off-topic, but if Chicago amnestied Boozer, could they make a run at Harden? He's literally the perfect player for them, and it's hard to imagine OKC could match what they offer

ILikePancakes
ILikePancakes 5pts like.author.displayName 1 Like

 @lmp5336  @justin_mia Harden may take less to stay in OKC...in my dreams.

ElMexiThunder
ElMexiThunder 5pts

 @lmp5336  @f5alcon  @ILikePancakes

 Hopefully he decides to play dumb and not realize what he'll be worth in his growth in a few years and stays for at most a near max.

lmp5336
lmp5336 5pts

 @f5alcon  @ILikePancakes True. I think Harden is a max or near-max player in general, but doesn't get enough opportunities here to be worth it.

ElMexiThunder
ElMexiThunder 5pts like.author.displayName like.author.displayName 2 Like

 @f5alcon  @ILikePancakes

Heres to dreaming the real dream. Harden and Ibaka staying on reasonable contracts so we can compete for the next half decade.  

f5alcon
f5alcon 5pts

 @ILikePancakes  no but we might match a max offer

ILikePancakes
ILikePancakes 5pts

 @justin_mia Won't happen with Russ and KD not even acknowledging he's on the floor

courtsense
courtsense 5pts

 @ILikePancakes  @justin_mia Which is why Russ, not Harden, needs to be in that deal. Then they can groom Reggie for that role, depending on what happens with Maynor. 

[censored]
[censored] 5pts

 @ILikePancakes PnR; Harden 1.06 PPP on 174 plays, Westbrook .79 PPP on 304 plays.  Gulp.

ElMexiThunder
ElMexiThunder 5pts

 @justin_mia

 and someone said he was inconsistent!!!!

persiansooner
persiansooner 5pts like.author.displayName 1 Like

I think it would be great for westbrook if he gets traded. He would get to shoot 30 times a game and wont get any shit from anyone.  I think hed average 35 on another team.

Meanwhile:

Howard

Ibaka

Durant

Harden

Any PG in NBA

 

OMG

jallenmorris
jallenmorris 5pts

 @persiansooner13 I think Maynor would fill that "Any PG in NBA" quite nicely.  He's a stud and to distribute to those guys would be insane. Now, I'm not saying I like the idea of getting rid of Russ.  I actually kind of HATE the idea, but I had to add that we can't forget about Maynor.  Does anyone actually think Reggie Jackson is ready to fill that "Any PG" roll?  I don't think so.

RRRWHOAAAA
RRRWHOAAAA 5pts

 @persiansooner13 every position in the nba is important... its like saying

 

Westbrook

Harden

Durant

Ibaka

Any Center in NBA

 

Still need a competent to elite PG these days... at least a mike Conley

persiansooner
persiansooner 5pts like.author.displayName 1 Like

 @RodneyRosavelRusanWilson Well that squad you mentioned has the best record in the nba haha

RRRWHOAAAA
RRRWHOAAAA 5pts like.author.displayName 1 Like

 @dancassidy35  @persiansooner13 We all know he is a liability on offense and underachieves as a rebounder most nights, but we dont have to double dwight howard or bynum... it was only this time last year when people wrote the thunder off because we were too small 

Fezzy
Fezzy 5pts

 @RodneyRosavelRusanWilson  @persiansooner13 In before someone shits on Perk

RRRWHOAAAA
RRRWHOAAAA 5pts

 @persiansooner13 Perkins is one of the best positional defenders in the NBA... not Any NBA Center... if we had that line up and Kristic it might be a different story.

 

My point is that a weak point gaurd would lead us to be abused even more by elite pgs, like how derick fisher gets abused... the same way elite bigs use to abuse us.... 

ILikePancakes
ILikePancakes 5pts

 @persiansooner13 Yeah, cool. And after this season, Harden and Ibaka walks because we have no money

Lost Ones
Lost Ones 5pts

 @persiansooner13 I prefer to trade harden, ibaka and perkins  we cant even afford that dumb ass roster.

ElMexiThunder
ElMexiThunder 5pts

The ideal trade would only to give up one of the cores perferably Westbrook, but more then likely we'd have to give up Ibaka.

courtsense
courtsense 5pts like.author.displayName like.author.displayName 2 Like

 @Lost Ones  @persiansooner13 Looks like Lost picked the wrong day to stop drinking...

f5alcon
f5alcon 5pts

 @courtsense  or start

SammyThunderer
SammyThunderer 5pts

Simmons trade column is worse than usual this year. How you have Harden ranked behind Derrick Williams, Paul George, and Serge is beyond me, but this paragraph takes the cake:

"Quick Minnesota tangent: I don't blame Kahn for picking Wesley Johnson in 2010. (I would have taken DeMarcus Cousins, but whatever.) Nobody killed that pick at the time — it made sense. But when you look at what Minnesota built from a painful six-year stretch of chronic losing (Love, Rubio, Pekovic, Williams, etc), what jumps out is that Johnson pick, which really came down to luck of the draw. They needed a perimeter player; he was the best one available. Two years earlier, they could have snagged Russ Westbrook or Eric Gordon. One year earlier, Tyreke Evans, Rubio and Curry were sitting there. But that year? Wes Johnson was the best available … and he just doesn't have it. If Westbrook stayed ONE extra year at UCLA, he goes first or second and pushes Evan Turner to Minnesota. Alas."

Leaving aside the stupidity of the Wes Johnson pick, how the hell do you a draft review of Kahn's tenure and just completely ignore Jonny Flynn?

Ozarkhick
Ozarkhick 5pts

 @SammyThunderer Better than when he compared Shaun Livingston to Magic Johnson, anyway.

lmp5336
lmp5336 5pts

 @SammyThunderer Don't sleep on Flynn. Dude's gonna be an impact player in Latvia or something in a few years

 

[censored]
[censored] 5pts

 @SammyThunderer Everyone knew Wes Johnson sucked.  And yeah, Harden below those guys is silly.

persiansooner
persiansooner 5pts

 @justin_mia  @SammyThunderer He mentioned how his "board" or whatever all had him in the 40s...I think it has something to do with Harden under-performing on National TV games, hes only had a couple good ones. I think the majority of them he was in single digits. Guys like us who watch every game know how good he really is

RRRWHOAAAA
RRRWHOAAAA 5pts

 @justin_mia  @SammyThunderer although I would argue against j.j.'s value long term

RRRWHOAAAA
RRRWHOAAAA 5pts

 @SammyThunderer he mentioned Flynn

RRRWHOAAAA
RRRWHOAAAA 5pts

 @SammyThunderer "David Kahn is becoming White Joe Dumars — either he's making a shrewd move (Rubio, Pekovic, J.J. Barea, Michael Beasley, Rick Adelman) or a lousy one (Johnny Flynn, Wes Johnson, Martell Webster, Darko's last contract, Kurt Rambis, only re-signing Love for three years instead of five) with no in-between."

Lost Ones
Lost Ones 5pts

why do people keep bringing up westbrook orlando dont need westbrook they ALREADY have nelson. we are the ones who would need a pg.

dollarbillrussell
dollarbillrussell 5pts

@Lost Ones You aren't very intelligent.

dollarbillrussell
dollarbillrussell 5pts

Aren't you the same person who was talking about how overrated and obsolete Harden is? Who exactly do you value on this team?

ElMexiThunder
ElMexiThunder 5pts like.author.displayName like.author.displayName 2 Like

 @ILikePancakes  @lmp5336  @Lost Ones  @dollarbillrussell

 I can't even grow a long stache right, and i'm mexican. Those things should be natural to me.

ILikePancakes
ILikePancakes 5pts like.author.displayName like.author.displayName 2 Like

 @ElMexiThunder  @lmp5336  @Lost Ones  @dollarbillrussell All i can grow is a little beard-like object :(

ElMexiThunder
ElMexiThunder 5pts

 @ILikePancakes  @lmp5336  @Lost Ones  @dollarbillrussell

 Very Consistent. Only if i could pull his beard off. I'de pick at it all day. Sit for moments at a time just looking off into the wall just grabbing my beard and knowing que chingon it is. Man thats a dream.

lmp5336
lmp5336 5pts

 @Lasers  @ElMexiThunder  @Lost Ones  @dollarbillrussell Well said

Lasers
Lasers 5pts like.author.displayName like.author.displayName like.author.displayName 3 Like

 @lmp5336  @ElMexiThunder  @Lost Ones  @dollarbillrussell i think it's made of obsidian

ILikePancakes
ILikePancakes 5pts

 @lmp5336  @ElMexiThunder  @Lost Ones  @dollarbillrussell How consistent is his beard?

lmp5336
lmp5336 5pts

 @ElMexiThunder  @Lost Ones  @dollarbillrussell Harden is about as consistent as his beard

ElMexiThunder
ElMexiThunder 5pts like.author.displayName 1 Like

 @Lost Ones  @dollarbillrussell

I can't believe you just called Harden Inconsistent.  

lmp5336
lmp5336 5pts like.author.displayName like.author.displayName like.author.displayName like.author.displayName 4 Like

 @Lost Ones  @dollarbillrussell He seems inconsistent because he takes 8-12 shots a game. Put him in say, Chicago, and he's a 20-5-5 guy easy

Lost Ones
Lost Ones 5pts

 @dollarbillrussell Harden is inconsistent as hell I dont value him as much as durant and westbrook who are generally on rather its a home game or away game.

ElMexiThunder
ElMexiThunder 5pts like.author.displayName 1 Like

 @Lost Ones

 Are you kidding me????? Nelson would play back up to Russ if they found a way to keep him and Russ. Dude wtf? lol

Lost Ones
Lost Ones 5pts

 @ElMexiThunder not with that horrible ass 8m per year contract.

ElMexiThunder
ElMexiThunder 5pts

 @Lost Ones

 HAHAHA... Man what where they thinking with that contract? Honestly Nelson is garbage but he's better then anything we have behind Russ.

lmp5336
lmp5336 5pts

 @Lost Ones Damn you f5alcon I was just typing that

f5alcon
f5alcon 5pts like.author.displayName like.author.displayName like.author.displayName like.author.displayName like.author.displayName 5 Like

 @lmp5336  lol and i got all the likes

f5alcon
f5alcon 5pts like.author.displayName like.author.displayName like.author.displayName like.author.displayName like.author.displayName 5 Like

 @Lost Ones that is about even with saying we don't need dwight we have perkins.

Lost Ones
Lost Ones 5pts

 @f5alcon we would trade perkins.

RRRWHOAAAA
RRRWHOAAAA 5pts like.author.displayName 1 Like

 @f5alcon  @Lost Ones true

ILikePancakes
ILikePancakes 5pts like.author.displayName 1 Like

 @Lost Ones What are you smokin', russ is top 5 PG

Trackbacks

  1. Dwight Howard Trade Rumors: Adding Howard Still A Risky Move For The Thunder | Kansas City MO DIRECTV Service says:
    March 9, 2012 at 12:57 pm

    [...] the end of the season, a rental of sorts. And therein lies the conundrum for the Thunder, as this report from Royce Young at the Daily Thunder believes adding Howard would make them favorites for an NBA title this [...]

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