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Wednesday Bolts – 10.31.12

by Royce Young on October 31, 2012 at 11:15 am 231 Comments

Bill Simmons continues to dislike OKC’s trade: “In the Thunder’s case, we only knew that they had three of the 20 best guys in the league, all under 25, all of whom loved playing together. There are no sure things in the NBA, but that previous sentence was about as sure as it gets. Less than 100 hours ago, I thought the Thunder were headed for another Finals and another chance at toppling LeBron and Wade. That’s not happening with Jeremy Lamb and Kevin Martin. Instead, they made a different kind of history: becoming the first NBA contender that ever jeopardized multiple titles for financial reasons and financial reasons only. It’s never happened before. They also walked away from the photo that adorns this column, as well as everything I ever thought sports was about. Other than that, the Harden trade wasn’t that big of a deal. You want predictions for the 2012-13 season from me? I have two and two only. 1. Miami is going to beat the Lakers in the Finals. 2. Oklahoma City will rue the day it traded James Harden.”

Amin Elhassan for ESPN.com on rookie contracts to extend: “This name might come as a curveball to many. After a strong sophomore season where he flourished as a playmaker (and ran point guard in crunch time, shifting Westbrook off the ball), he saw his third year almost completely obliterated by an ACL injury. Maynor is exactly what a team is looking for in a backup in terms of being a playmaker, perimeter threat and decent on-ball defender. With Harden’s trade to Houston, Maynor’s importance to Oklahoma City increases as the main playmaker off the bench, particularly as the Thunder try to maintain continuity in their organization. Thunder GM Sam Presti has already stated he’s going to let the season play out, but if a deal can be struck with Maynor, I think you have to move to lock him up.”

Zach Lowe of Grantland says Serge Ibaka is the most important player in the league this year: “It was true before the James Harden trade, and it’s probably even more true now: Ibaka is the most important player in the league. The Thunder have made a long-term bet that two wings and one big man is a better big-money core than three wings and a patchwork of cost-effective bigs. The Harden–Russell Westbrook–Kevin Durant trio would have always presented some redundancies, but they are all more or less sure All-Star talents. Ibaka, despite the astounding shot blocks and bogus runner-up finish in last season’s Defensive Player of the Year voting, isn’t at that level. He has to at least approach it for the Thunder to remain title contenders this season and going forward.”

Nick Collison’s diary returns: “I am all-in these days, Diary. There can be no tiptoeing. I do everything all the way. There are no half measures. Not in Walter White’s Albuquerque and not in this empty world. You go full or you don’t go at all. I am a Pontic Aztec and I run into the wolves that are the dealers. But I have no Jesse. I am alone. So I tell myself to run. I run to the ocean. There is salt in the air around me and I know I am close and that is good. Sonic Happy Hour good. I invite the wolves to give chase. Come at me, bros.”

J.A. Adande of ESPN.com on the Western impact of the Harden trade: “The camaraderie on the Thunder has been charming. One member of the organization referred to them as “a college team kicking ass in the NBA.” I liked to call them Carver High, after the squad in the “White Shadow” TV show. No more collegial atmosphere. No more Carver High. After this move, the Thunder are strictly business. And what of the fans? The Thunder enjoy a bond with the community that is unmatched in the NBA, and no player enjoyed a greater connection with that vocal crowd than Harden. You could see it with all the beards strapped onto fans wearing No. 13 jerseys. You could hear it in the roar whenever he checked into the game.”

Perry Jones’s snake will kill you.

Israel Gutierrez of ESPN.com looking at the East side of it: “The most aggravating argument in favor of Harden in Oklahoma City is that he’s what made the Thunder unique/special. I’m sorry, but no. What makes the Thunder special is they have a 24-year-old, near 7-footer who can score from any spot on the floor with ease. What makes them unique is that they have arguably the game’s best athlete, and he plays the point guard position. What makes them special is that they have a 23-year-old who easily led the league in blocks last season and has scary potential. Harden is an excellent player — one whom Heat coach Erik Spoelstra will even say you must thoroughly prepare for defensively, which his Heat obviously did last postseason.”

One Thunder fan penned a really great goodbye to James Harden. Highly recommend reading it.

SLAM has KD No. 2: “Durant has a supernatural scoring touch and he’s still learning new ways to get buckets. He’s on his way to being a true rival to LeBron. In the Playoffs, Durant couldn’t help the Thunder beat the Heat, but he officially arrived at a point where he’ll be competing directly against LeBron for a while. If that’s so, eyes from far and wide will turn to OKC and the shape of the NBA will be forever changed. The last NBA Finals was totally new territory for OKC and Durant has a habit of maturing and adapting to new territory quickly.”

Berry Tramel on if Harden had signed: “OK, let’s move to 2014-15. In that season, the Thunder would be committed to $74 million for six players — Durant, Westbrook, Ibaka, Harden, Collison and Perkins. You can’t fill out the rest of the roster with minimum salaries, so the payroll would start to expand. Let’s add eight players, at $1.5 million each. That’s still bare bones. But it’s $12 million. So that’s $86 million. Let’s say the luxury tax goes up to $74 million, which is fairly generous. The Thunder’s luxury tax would be $21.25 million. That’s serious money. Again, you could amnesty Perkins, but the hole would be even greater in this season, because you would be down to five core players accounting for most of the payroll.”

Jeff Caplan of NBA.com on Ibaka: “With Harden out of the picture, Ibaka’s offensive game could be asked to expand. His numbers, both scoring and rebounding, have remained the same the last two seasons. But put aside scoring for the moment — Durant, Russell Westbrook and Kevin Martin will provide plenty — if the Thunder expect to get past the game’s best rebounder and the transformed Lakers and return to the NBA Finals, Ibaka will have to become a far greater force on the defensive boards.”

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Thunderman
Thunderman 5pts

"Oklahoma city will rue the day it traded James Harden" Like that's a hard prediction? We were rueing it before it happened. Like fans can stop it? My hope is we disprove the doubters and continue in dominance but my gut feeling is we will be lucky to make the playoffs.

RRRWHOAAAA
RRRWHOAAAA 5pts

probably already been posted, but

 

http://espn.go.com/blog/truehoop/post/_/id/50866/truehoop-tv-david-thorpe-talks-thunder

C-Wil
C-Wil 5pts

Did anyone watch that Laker game last and see what a joke they were? God they were bad. I don't see how it's going to work out with them, might I say they could be worse than last year. 

Durienne
Durienne 5pts like.author.displayName like.author.displayName 2 Like

 @BlueLightSpecial It depends on how long they intend to keep Peyton Manning in the Wishbone offense (i.e. turning Nash into an Off Guard = Fail).  Once they figure that out, they should be fine.  Let's hope they don't.

As Promised
As Promised 5pts

Ibaka+Perkins+Chop Sticks for Kevin Love?  Would you guys do it?

[censored]
[censored] 5pts like.author.displayName like.author.displayName like.author.displayName 3 Like

 @thelaughingwiseman Yes but Minnesota would not.  

As Promised
As Promised 5pts

 @justin_mia How would the Thunder be able to require him?  Just wait until 2016 when he acquire's his player option then, huh?  Kendrick Perkins and Nick Collison would be off the Books after the 2014-15 season

RRRWHOAAAA
RRRWHOAAAA 5pts

 @thelaughingwiseman  @justin_mia this is where the cba makes it difficult. you can only have one player per team on the real max level. any player who wants a max deal then might not want to sign here long term. not just here, but any team with a 5 year guy

As Promised
As Promised 5pts

I think Martin makes a perfect back-up to come off the bench with Collison and Maynor.  Those guys seem like they can calm the tempo down especially with Kevin Durant in the line-up.  The B line-up of Collison-PJ3-Durant-Martin-Maynor seems pretty smooth and you can switch PJ3 with Ibaka or Perkins too.  I just want to see Lamb get some time, but alas Brooks is too stubborn to play him or even look at him

JeremyBrewer
JeremyBrewer 5pts

 @thelaughingwiseman I would like to see Martin in the starting line-up ala the celts. Let Lamb and PJ3 provide some offense, or allow Maynor to keep chucking ( seems like he is trying to shot more, directed by team?).

 

Grolgar
Grolgar 5pts

 @JeremyBrewer  @thelaughingwiseman

 Or just stagger rotations. It's not like all 5 guys come out at once.

As Promised
As Promised 5pts

 @Grolgar  @JeremyBrewer Trading Jeff Green

As Promised
As Promised 5pts

 @Grolgar  @JeremyBrewer I would really like for Lamb to get minutes.  What would it take for Lamb to get minutes?  Trade away Thabo?  That's what they had to do to get Ibaka meaningful minutes. 

Durienne
Durienne 5pts like.author.displayName 1 Like

 @JeremyBrewer  @thelaughingwiseman I'm really excited to see what the Westbrook/Sefolosha/Martin/Durant/Ibaka lineup can do.

JeremyBrewer
JeremyBrewer 5pts

 @thelaughingwiseman  @Durienne Crap, thought Martin was 6'5", that is some length in there.

As Promised
As Promised 5pts

 @Durienne  @JeremyBrewer haha I don't think that's small ball either...  Look at that size in the middle!  Westbrook at 6'4 is nearly a SG, Thabo and Martin are 6'7 and KD and Ibaka are 6'10, there is going to be a lot of athletism.  I also think Martin and Thabo can play well off each other. 

JeremyBrewer
JeremyBrewer 5pts

 @Durienne  @thelaughingwiseman Haven't thought of that line-up for smallball. Three great scorers, and two D stars.

JeremyBrewer
JeremyBrewer 5pts

Color me carefully optimistic. I want to reserve the ledge until I see Martin in a Ray Allen role, along with the improvement I think is quite possible in Ibaka's game. How many AAU games, and high school matches, and all-american tourneys did Harden have while Ibaka was stuffing his only pair of shoes with cardboard to figure bball out? Ibaka might be the best late bloomer this sport has seen in a decade or two. Yes, Harden was my favorite for reasons that might not all have been about the court. Yes, I loved his old-school game. But we have two out of the top 7-8 players in the game offensively already. I see the Spurs in us, ten years of maybe being able to win, if the cards line up.If we win, Martin might be ready for a home town discount next year. He is already rich. It would be nice to have a player over thirty getting significant time on this squad.

 

Grolgar
Grolgar 5pts

 @JeremyBrewer

 The only flaw in the "late bloomr" argument is that he didn't bloom last year. His produciton leveled out...

JeremyBrewer
JeremyBrewer 5pts

 @Grolgar Hoping his late start in life makes his fourth or fifth year as a nba pro more like a third year bust out (I am wearing rose colored glasses this halloween).

 

JeremyBrewer
JeremyBrewer 5pts

curry signed for 4 years, 11 per, FYI

rednuht
rednuht 5pts

If Lamb isn't part of our present and getting rotation minutes is there any chance he is part of our future?

 

Has there been a player in our short history that wasn't in the rotation in year one but went on to be part of the future? Even Ibaka played in his first year.

Grolgar
Grolgar 5pts

 @rednuht

 Great point. I really think we have to give more opportunities to guys that are supposed to be part of the future. If we'd played Cole more in the regular season over Nazr then he wouldn't have been such a mystery... Maybe that's about to happen with Reggie.

JeremyBrewer
JeremyBrewer 5pts

 @rednuht That could happen now that we are a great team. He could play himself into a Thabo replaecment by halfway through next year. Twenty points a game in preseason is pretty hopeful.

Legendary_Dork
Legendary_Dork 5pts like.author.displayName like.author.displayName like.author.displayName like.author.displayName like.author.displayName like.author.displayName 6 Like

so a guy came into my job today dressed up like zombie harden , and on the back it say, RIP, your dead to me.  I kinda laughed..not gonna lie  :P 

cleandoe
cleandoe 5pts like.author.displayName like.author.displayName like.author.displayName 3 Like

 @Legendary_Dork You laughed because of the spelling mistake, right?

Legendary_Dork
Legendary_Dork 5pts like.author.displayName like.author.displayName 2 Like

 @cleandoe *you're  :P    but his was your

Legendary_Dork
Legendary_Dork 5pts like.author.displayName 1 Like

 @cleandoe to be honest i kinda knew what he was getting at before i read the back. but yeah. still good stuff. 

cleandoe
cleandoe 5pts like.author.displayName like.author.displayName like.author.displayName 3 Like

 @Legendary_Dork I knew it :D

DXL
DXL 5pts like.author.displayName 1 Like

David Thorpe also seems to believe that the Thunder offense has a chance to be #1 in the league with Martin. I agree. Martin, ignoring his injury-plagued year in 11-12, is a top 5 shooting guard, and fits in perfectly with Durant and Westbrook. He can be effective off the ball in a way that Harden can't.

 

In the preseason I saw defenders adjusting to Harden's quirky game, anticipating his Eurostep move, for example, and drawing charges. As the #1 option in Houston he's going to be dealing with defenders like Shawn Marion every night and his game is going to be put under a lot of pressure. When Harden took over the game against Dallas in the playoffs he mostly feasted on Delonte West. Those kinds of matchups won't be available anymore.

rednuht
rednuht 5pts like.author.displayName 1 Like

 @DXL Our offense is going to win us a lot of regular season games, but if we can improve the defense, we have a shot at the championship.

DXL
DXL 5pts like.author.displayName 1 Like

 @rednuht Agreed, the defense must improve. Is a trade for a quality defensive center possible? Would Perkins and the Toronto pick net a quality player? Gortat? Pekovic? Take a shot at turning Robin Lopez around?

Grolgar
Grolgar 5pts

 @justin_mia  @rednuht

 You doubt Presti will do it after what he just did? ;)

[censored]
[censored] 5pts

 @rednuht For example, what if Nene gets healthy and (for argument's sake) we ship Martin and our picks for him.  Where does he play?  Any big guy on a long term contract that is any sort of good would cause problems because Perkins is here.  If we're going to include picks with Martin to acquire this person, you want them to start.  But you can't start them without dealing with Perkins in some way.  I just don't see them crossing that bridge in the middle of a season.

[censored]
[censored] 5pts

 @rednuht Dalembert's not that bad, BTW.

[censored]
[censored] 5pts

 @rednuht There are but I don't see any way to acquire them that doesn't also involve moving, or otherwise dealing with, Perkins.  And I don't think we do that during the year.

rednuht
rednuht 5pts

 @justin_mia  I just threw up a little bit in my mouth.

 

Is it wrong to want more than Dalembert? Presti could have had him at any time, there's got to be someone better.

[censored]
[censored] 5pts like.author.displayName like.author.displayName 2 Like

 @rednuht  @DXL Dalembert is expiring.  Might be available.

rednuht
rednuht 5pts

 @DXL Would a trade be made for defense or for a player that brought more offense without being a matador on defense?

 

You can't tell me any of Gortat, Pekovic or Lopez is better than Perkins defensively.........can you?

[censored]
[censored] 5pts like.author.displayName like.author.displayName 2 Like

 @DXL They would have been available on our team if he stayed.  

DXL
DXL 5pts like.author.displayName 1 Like

 @justin_mia Martin's going to get those weaker matchups and he's going to feast on them. The guy is a top offensive threat and has never played with all-stars before. If he can score 18 ppg with 60% true shooting efficiency then OKC's offense will be among the best in the league again.

[censored]
[censored] 5pts

 @rednuht  @AndrewOKC  @DXL I agree.  Maynor is not a skilled offensive player.

rednuht
rednuht 5pts

 @justin_mia  @AndrewOKC  @DXL Scoring with the second unit seems to be where many want to rely on Maynor, but I question if he is up to it.

 

If Westbrook and Durant are both out of the game at the same time, I'd rather have Jackson attacking than Maynor trying to be what Harden was.

 

Notice I don't mention Lamb, as he seems to be the man out.

rednuht
rednuht 5pts

 @justin_mia  @DXL Martin projects to be better alongside Westbrook and Durant than what we saw with Harden. Martin's ability to move and play without the ball could act as an improved bridge between Westbrook and Durant.

 

What we lose is Harden running the offense when Westbrook gets stuck but what we gain is better offensive movement, which will perhaps prevent Westbrook from getting stuck in the first place?

[censored]
[censored] 5pts like.author.displayName 1 Like

 @AndrewOKC  @DXL He's not BAD in the PnR but he's not Harden-good, is all I'm saying, and our second unit relied heavily on Harden PnR to score.  Martin is no slouch offensively.

DXL
DXL 5pts like.author.displayName 1 Like

Yeah, Martin also looks to be very clever with the ball. He's not as good as Harden but he may be smarter. His game is a joy to watch.

AndrewOKC
AndrewOKC 5pts

 @justin_mia  @DXL actually that isnt true Martin actually has pretty good number out of the pick and roll... .988 pts/pos last year i believe ranked in the top 20 in PnR and this preseason he has been even better posting something like 1.348 Pts/pos out of PnR

[censored]
[censored] 5pts like.author.displayName like.author.displayName 2 Like

 @DXL Martin doesn't make his teammates better like James did.  Not the best in PnR or with the ball in his hands.  The only thing he does better than Harden is shoot from mid-range.  The offense will still be one of the better ones in the league but it's hard to see them not taking a step back.  OKC had by far the best offense in the NBA with Harden, Durant, and Westbrook on the court together, and one of the worst with Harden off the court.

OBoyzOld Man
OBoyzOld Man 5pts like.author.displayName like.author.displayName like.author.displayName 3 Like

"Dear Perry:  Enough with the snake, bro.  Kinda creepin' me out, if you know what I mean.  Ever since that day in the Garden I just get a bad case of the heebie jeebies when I see one.  Anyhow - I like what I'm seeing from you (except the snake thing).  Just follow KD's lead and you gonna be just fine.  Bless you."

cleandoe
cleandoe 5pts like.author.displayName 1 Like

http://www.dailythunder.com/2012/10/video-perk-isnt-signing-your-goofy-song/

Norman ooooo-oo-ooo-ooo-oooo~

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