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3-on-3: Reacting to Harden’s return

by Royce Young on November 28, 2012 at 1:10 pm 198 Comments

Bill Baptist/NBAE/Getty Images

The Beard comes back to Oklahoma City tonight. Just one month exactly after he left. As one person texted me, it definitely has that ex-boyfriend-is-coming-back-over-to-get-their-things vibe to it.

How should Thunder fans react to his return? And more importantly, with a month in the rearview mirror, how has this whole thing worked out?

1. Should Thunder fans boo James Harden tonight?

Royce Young, Daily Thunder: Don’t boo. But outside of pregame introductions, don’t cheer either. I’m definitely on record saying that I’m not a fan of the way Harden handled things publicly, but at the same time, the guy deserved his money. He earned that max deal and the fact was, the Thunder weren’t willing to give it to him. They could’ve, but they didn’t. That’s not Harden’s fault. At the same time, there were some hurt feelings because of the way Harden talked about sacrificing and brotherhood and all that crap. Booing just makes Thunder fans look petty, but the fact is, he’s on the other team now. He’s not one of us anymore. He gave us great memories and moments. But that stuff is just history now.

Patrick James, Daily Thunder: Sure, if he does something worth booing. But not just for showing up. My prediction for what will happen is the same I’ve heard most everywhere else: He’ll be cheered when he’s introduced and then mostly ignored. Maybe some light boos when he hits a 3-pointer and does his celebration. And that’s about it. He made a choice that most people are over, even if they were mad about it at the time. Most people are thankful he was in town for three years. And they’ll react accordingly.

Eddie Maisonet, Sports Fan Journal/SB Nation: If they did I’d be thoroughly disappointed in them. Its easy to say what you would do if someone offered you $54-80 million to play basketball, but no one’s knocking on your door to do such a thing. The Fear The Beard movement started in OKC, and we’ll continue to cherish the 2009-12 Thunder era many moons from now.

2. Through 15 games, would this season look any different with Harden on the roster?

Young: The only game I think the Thunder win that they lost if they had Harden is the opening night game against the Spurs. OKC got a dose of Bad Russell that night on top of trying to sort out a major roster change just two days before. Other than that, the season’s gone mostly according to plan. It’s not like the Thunder would be 15-0 with Harden, but there were some fears of what the Thunder would do without him. Which is what makes their 11-4 record look pretty solid right now. With Harden on the roster, people would probably be searching less for flaws and a little more comfortable with the team though.

James: Probably not. The way this season feels would be different, but not the way it looks. The Thunder would be right on pace to be a top seed in the West. The teams that are pretty good would still be pretty good. Only the uncertainty of how all this will look in key moments in May is what makes it feel a little different, and getting used to the changes in style of play necessitated by replacing Harden with Kevin Martin. But the Thunder resemble a contender. Once people get used to the way the team plays, and the Thunder have a few statement wins under their belt, the remaining uncertainty will start to melt away.

Maisonet: Oklahoma City probably wins 1-2 more games with Harden versus Kevin Martin, but 12-3 (with a 7-game winning streak) versus 11-4 (with a shuffled roster days before the regular season starts) with a 3-game lead in the division after 15 games? That’s plenty acceptable either way you look at it.

3. With a month to reflect on, did Sam Presti make the right move?

Young: I didn’t like the move much when it happened. Part of that was because I was completely stunned, part of it was because I simply didn’t like it. But I definitely understand why the move was made and in terms of it being right, I think it was. It kept the Thunder very competitive in the West in the short-term while still keeping the long-term bright. It sucks that we’ll never know what a Westbrook-Durant-Ibaka-Harden core could’ve done over the next four or five seasons, but that’s just it. We might not ever know if it was the “right” move, since we can’t know if with Harden OKC would’ve won a title. If they win one with Martin or the future assets that came with it, then it’s absolutely validated.

James: The only thing you can really tell after a month, if you can tell anything, is whether or not a trade is immediately apparent as a disaster. And that certainly isn’t the case. And what would have been a disaster anyway, Martin shooting 30 percent and Kevin Durant and Russell Westbrook feuding? The former would be something that would correct itself a bit over time, and the latter shows no sign of ever happening except for the momentary battles any set of teammates will share over the course of a long season and long career. You can’t really give a definitive answer to this until after the playoffs and after Martin signs his next contract. But it’s truly impossible to already say it’s the wrong move — and as long as that’s the case, the faith in Presti is justified.

Maisonet: It’s still too early to tell. While I think the trade itself was great for the future, the trade told me that OKC never really intended to pay Harden anyway. Thusly, the Thunder were going to move in a different direction. What will be more interesting is the next couple of moves that are sitting on Presti’s desk. Do they move Kendrick Perkins? Do they re-package Martin + picks for another stud wing? Do they re-sign Martin and move forward towards a title run? Presti’s always been perceived as playing chess with checkers players, and time will tell if he’s truly the Bobby Fischer of general managers or not.

Categories
3-on-3
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182 comments
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Lambchop
Lambchop 5pts

There is far too much rumor and hearsay surrounding his decision.  To make definiteve moral judgements is a disservice to all parties involved, including wounded fan.  I wish him well only in so far as we beat them 

stg609
stg609 5pts

I would take a contract for less than 1 mill to dig ditches in the cold. Harden left OKC when 56 mill wasn't good enough and the job is to play a game...

Air Bud
Air Bud 5pts

http://www.dailythunder.com/2012/11/rockets-vs-thunder-pregame-primer-6/#more-23087

BallSoHard
BallSoHard 5pts

Wait, so is the game showing on NBATV tonight or regular league pass channels?

jhawkcowgirl
jhawkcowgirl 5pts

We all loved James.  But he has moved on & so should we.  Bring your Beards to the Shear the Beard party in ThunderAlley @ 6:30 tonight.

Crow
Crow 5pts

"...the trade told me that OKC never really intended to pay Harden anyway."

 

The 1 hour deadline might or might have been a sign of that.

Crow
Crow 5pts

huh?

OBoy
OBoy 5pts like.author.displayName like.author.displayName 2 Like

 @Crow James had months to make a decision, his agent told Presti in the summer that they weren't taking less than max and they didn't change their mind. Royce believes Harden and his agent wanted to stall so that the Houston offer wasn't available and that Harden's preference was to play out the season without a contract and then pick his team. 

Perk-Nightmares
Perk-Nightmares 5pts

 @Crow  @OBoy Jones III

 that perkins contract is horrible.

Crow
Crow 5pts

 @OBoy Jones III  @PerkPunt yeah a return and a reasonable hope for future returns may be enough... unless one or both just decide they want to "start a new chapter" or whatever.

OBoy
OBoy 5pts like.author.displayName like.author.displayName 2 Like

 @Crow  @PerkPunt my theory is that if we go to the finals again they will be here past their current contracts. Lebron and Dwight went to one finals and left.

Crow
Crow 5pts like.author.displayName like.author.displayName 2 Like

 @PerkPunt  @OBoy Jones III Long way away for me to think too much about that right now. Maybe next summer.

Crow
Crow 5pts

 @PerkPunt  @OBoy Jones III I think  Russ is signed for one year longer than Durant

 

http://hoopshype.com/salaries/oklahoma_city.htm

 

Either they will lock up Durant to an early extension or he will decline it and decide in summer 2016. I guess they could sign Durant regular and Russ early at the same time if both are willing and the team wants to in summer 2016.

Perk-Nightmares
Perk-Nightmares 5pts

 @Crow  @OBoy Jones III

 YES! he made a statement for all future negotiations. Does this have implications when KD and russ are free agents together?

Crow
Crow 5pts like.author.displayName 1 Like

 @OBoy Jones III James apparently expected Presti to cave at the end. I don't know if the agent believed that or not. Future players and agents are being asked to believe that he won't.

Crow
Crow 5pts

 @OBoy Jones III that is "more of the story" but leaves the 1 hour deadline a part of the story too.

Perk-Nightmares
Perk-Nightmares 5pts

 @OBoy Jones III  @Crow

 that makes the hour deadline more interesting. It almost reminds me of money ball when the guys where putting people on hold before a deal was made. the back n forth of it all. I think presti knew in advance that Harden wouldnt change his mind. Looked at the market and made his call.

Crow
Crow 5pts

Harden said it did. I can't imagine Presti not responding to that "claim" if not true.

Crow
Crow 5pts like.author.displayName 1 Like

Presti has quite wistful even pessimistic and not really his normal self when he talked about the difficulties of signing Harden about a month before the deal. It appears to me he more expected to not succeed with the signing than succeed.

Fisha Status
Fisha Status 5pts like.author.displayName like.author.displayName 2 Like

 @PerkPunt  @Crow exactly. When you're frustrated with something in business...you throw out deadlines for action. The 1 hour deadline says to me, you havent been seeing anything happening or receiving the attention to a situation that is very important. Light a fire under their a$$ to act NOW. 

 

OKC did the right thing. Waited any longer and Thunder wouldve been Dwight Howarded like Orlando or Chris Boshed like Toronoto. They couldnt pay what he was asking and he would've walked away ANYWAY at the end of the season.

Perk-Nightmares
Perk-Nightmares 5pts like.author.displayName like.author.displayName 2 Like

 @Crow

 i agree . I remember reading some quotes and feeling uneasy about the tone of Presti's words.  He sounded frustrated.

OBoy
OBoy 5pts

 @Crow that was BS. 

OBoy
OBoy 5pts

 @Crow as in it didn't happen. 

f5alcon
f5alcon 5pts like.author.displayName like.author.displayName 2 Like

 @OBoy Jones III  @Crow the one hour thing was a last thing to give him a chance to not be traded but he had all summer to work out a deal

OBoy
OBoy 5pts like.author.displayName like.author.displayName 2 Like

Lol anyone interested in Jimmer? there's another report that he's not happy in Sacramento today. He's playing less minutes this year (because they signed Aaron Brooks) but shooting better. 

Crow
Crow 5pts

 @OBoy Jones III probably not but I haven't seen recent tape of him to say for sure.

Crow
Crow 5pts

 @OBoy Jones III certainly would not give up much good for him

OBoy
OBoy 5pts

 @Crow I wouldn't put it past the Kings to trade all 3 and start Tyreke at the point. Or trade Tyreke and start all 3 PG's!

Crow
Crow 5pts

 @OBoy Jones III though that is somewhat influenced by the past and may not fully reflect what he is now or will be going forward.

Crow
Crow 5pts

 @OBoy Jones III Jimmer the clear best of the 3 by boxscore, pretty likely worst by RAPM estimate.

Crow
Crow 5pts

 @OBoy Jones III yeah. they probably will trade one of the PGs.

OBoy
OBoy 5pts like.author.displayName 1 Like

 @Crow I would like to know how much more it would take to get Isaiah Thomas now that they seem to have chosen Brooks as a starter.

Crow
Crow 5pts like.author.displayName 1 Like

 @OBoy Jones III But not Maynor, a #1 and maybe something else of value.

Crow
Crow 5pts

 @OBoy Jones III I'd be willing in that scenario.

OBoy
OBoy 5pts like.author.displayName 1 Like

 @Crow there were rumors in the summer we were interested in him and most speculated maynor would be the one traded. 

Crow
Crow 5pts

 @OBoy Jones III How different is he from Rautins really? That is a question not an informed statement.

OUThunderfan
OUThunderfan 5pts like.author.displayName like.author.displayName 2 Like

 @OBoy Jones III NO!

Fisha Status
Fisha Status 5pts

 @OUThunderfan  @OBoy Jones III You mean real life? or fantasy? 

 

LOL

BallSoHard
BallSoHard 5pts

It was said earlier...but man, I really want to try and get Parsons. Maybe we can get in on a 3-way trade and grab him somehow?

OBoy
OBoy 5pts

 @BallSoHard like the trade for James Harden? lol he was originally in it. 

 

We probably could have taken Parsons over Lamb. 

anonymous12345
anonymous12345 5pts

 @OBoy Jones III  @BallSoHard He would have been great to have on the 2nd unit, backing up KD

anonymous12345
anonymous12345 5pts

 @BallSoHard He was part of Presti's first offer for Harden and Houston said no.

BallSoHard
BallSoHard 5pts

@anonymous12345 yes, I realize

ThunderGunner
ThunderGunner 5pts

how about "sophia the beard" (distract him with a high class hooker)

Tronchaser
Tronchaser 5pts

Did Dennis ever post the onfloor pic of the DT'ers (plus a lot of other people) from the Clipper game?

long arm of the law
long arm of the law 5pts like.author.displayName 1 Like

 @Tronchaser if so i didn't see it

holeydonut
holeydonut 5pts like.author.displayName like.author.displayName like.author.displayName like.author.displayName like.author.displayName like.author.displayName like.author.displayName 7 Like

I'd still rather have Serge over the Beard.  Sometimes Serge has this look about him like he wants to rip someone's head off.  Harden's most emotional time tends to remind me of TMac after he drinks a cup of coffee.

Fisha Status
Fisha Status 5pts like.author.displayName like.author.displayName 2 Like

 @holeydonut LMAOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO cant get no more nonchalant than TMac after coffee...

 

I'm crying

Fisha Status
Fisha Status 5pts like.author.displayName like.author.displayName like.author.displayName like.author.displayName 4 Like

All jokes aside. No one should boo him. Clap as hard as you can. Standing ovation. 

It'd make him feel guilty. 

 

Booing him might inspire him. 

Air Bud
Air Bud 5pts like.author.displayName like.author.displayName 2 Like

 @Perkfection Please give me $80 million to feel guilty.

TaoMaas
TaoMaas 5pts like.author.displayName like.author.displayName 2 Like

 @Skyline    You've got a deal!  I'll give you a call after the lottery drawing tonight.

BallSoHard
BallSoHard 5pts like.author.displayName 1 Like

@Skyline @Perkfection beware...we will clap for you as hard as we can if we do.

Fisha Status
Fisha Status 5pts

 @BallSoHard  @Skyline  @Perkfection He'll never be upset about the money. But its feeling guilty about leaving something special.

 

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