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Five leftovers from the schooling in San Antonio

by Royce Young on March 12, 2013 at 12:44 pm 829 Comments
Screen Shot 2013-03-12 at 2.05.43 PM

Garrett Ellwood/NBAE/Getty Images

A couple additional thoughts that popped in my head after sleeping on the Thunder’s 105-93 loss to the Spurs last night:

1. Bench slapped. It’s not that the San Antonio bench completely destroyed the Thunder’s, it’s just that the Thunder’s second unit couldn’t hold down the fort at all. In terms of plus/minus, the four rotation bench guys were -24, -22, -21 and -15. They scored a total of 16 points to the Spurs’ 34.

The shame of it is that OKC’s bench was rolling in the first quarter and early second. Kevin Martin hit three 3s in a short span, seemingly setting a wonderful tone for the second unit. After Martin hit his last 3 with 10:11 left in the second quarter, he didn’t hit another shot, and only actually even attempted two more, both 3-pointers early in the fourth quarter.

Some nights, OKC’s bench looks dynamic and powerful. Others, it looks anemic and weak. And what makes it worrisome, it seems it’s often the latter against the good teams.

Also: Yes, I am pretty proud of my bench puns.

2. Westbrook 27, KD 13. So Russell Westbrook took 27 shots last night and Kevin Durant only took 13. Are we really back to making this A Thing again?

First, looking at raw shot attempt numbers doesn’t even remotely tell the story of offensive distribution. Factor in the fact Durant took 11 free throws to Westbrook’s three, and that’s roughly the equivalent to five added shots for Durant. Still, that would be 27-18, a number that would clearly upset the boneheaded masses anyway.

What was clear to those watching last night is that the Thunder were dead in the water mid-way through the third quarter when Westbrook did his best to provide a needed offensive spark. Westbrook took eight shots in the third, hitting five. He took seven shots in the fourth, hitting one. And get this: All seven were at the rim, except one, which was a six-foot jumper inside the free throw line.

What’s always obvious about Westbrook is that when games go as the one did last night in San Antonio, he lets it all hang loose. He gives zero effs about shot numbers or percentages at that point, and just starts competing. He added three attempts to his total last night just because he crashed the offensive glass and tried putbacks. He goes into “ATTACK SCORE ATTACK” mode and tries to shoulder the responsibility of putting OKC back in it. It’s often misguided and unwise, but it’s always appreciated.

Here’s the other thing: Westbrook was wild and he most certainly got carried away. He shot too much. But if you don’t think Westbrook has earned the right to shoot 30 times, you’re either You-Know-Who or you don’t pay attention. He’s probably been the team’s MVP the second half of the season, playing maybe as well as he ever has in his career. I say it all the time, but just because he has the good fortune of the best scorer in the world being his teammate doesn’t mean he’s supposed to neuter his talents and play like he’s Jose Calderon or something.

We should be past this noise about who shots more. Westbrook is a far less efficient scorer than Durant, but that in specific games, that doesn’t mean he has no right to shoulder the offensive burden.

3. Catfished. When I looked at the box score when the final buzzer sounded last night, it said Derek Fisher played 12 minutes. I could’ve sworn he played all 48. It felt that way, at least.

Now, before I rag on Fisher here, I have to say, you can’t deny that he’s played pretty well in places since he signed. He’s shot the ball well, he’s even made a few plays too. He’s added, not subtracted.

But last night brought to life the great fear of Thunder fans. There was Fisher, on the floor in the fourth quarter, for some reason. Sitting on the bench: Thabo Sefolosha, Kevin Martin and Reggie Jackson. And if you want to extrapolate further, Jeremy Lamb and DeAndre Liggins were figuratively on the bench as well.

In 12 minutes, Fisher was a -21. He was on the floor for both big San Antonio runs. Now, I can’t be selective and ignore that Collison was actually the biggest minus (-24) so it’s not fair to just single out Fisher. BUT with Collison, I know why he was on the floor. I still don’t with Fisher.

4. Beardless. I wrote about the Harden factor, or lack thereof for ESPN.com last night. I was probably being a little dramatic, but it is somewhat true: The last time the Thunder won in San Antonio, it was one the back of Harden’s dagger 3. And unless they overtake the Spurs in these last few weeks, assuming the road to the Finals has to go through them again, the Thunder would be required to win at least one game in San Antonio.

Can they do that without James Harden?

5. Chillllllll. At least just a little bit. I understand that when the Thunder don’t perform in big games, it raises the collective blood pressure of the fanbase. Because this team underwent such a significant roster change before the season, you can’t downplay losses with the “Oh they’re fine, look at what they did last year” point. This team is different without Harden, so it opens the door to dissection of the lineups Scott Brooks’ uses, the personnel and the play of everyone. With each big loss, it feels like it’s a window into potential future postseason failures.

But, it’s March and the Thunder just lost on the road on in their fourth game in five nights to the Spurs. Yep, no Tony Parker for San Antonio, but if anything, I think that just means there’s less to take away here. Had the Thunder won, it would’ve been “Yeah, but Tony Parker didn’t play.” Since they lost, all of a sudden Parker not playing is a really big deal.

Look, the Thunder had major problems with the Spurs last season. The first two games of the Western Finals, the Thunder looked overmatched and lost, and that was with James Harden. Things flipped though and the Thunder pulled off what they had to do. Yes, this team is different this time around and it will be more challenging without Harden. But playing the selective memory game and lashing out with bold statements like “SCOTT BROOKS IS NOT A CHAMPIONSHIP COACH” is just too much. Monday’s game was ugly and certainly not on the encouraging end of things, but let’s see what happens April 4 when the Spurs visit OKC.

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Heatforever
Heatforever 5pts

Thunder need to get rid of westbrook if they ever plan on winning a championship. Scott brooks could also use some advice from the amazing HoF gregg popvich. Thunder need to make some adjustments if they plan on beating miami in the finals! Lebron james is the best & he will show no mercy. Let's go heat. 2012 nba champions!

THUNDER FOR THE WIN
THUNDER FOR THE WIN 5pts like.author.displayName 1 Like

http://dailythunder.com/2013/03/wednesday-bolts-3-13-13/

BallSoHard
BallSoHard 5pts

Eight of the final 18 game are against teams that are below .500. Five of those eight — Orlando (twice), Washington, Minnesota and Sacramento — are all at least 18 games below .500. This will be nice.

Fezzy
Fezzy 5pts like.author.displayName like.author.displayName like.author.displayName 3 Like

For anyone who likes to watch them, Tulsa plays tonight at 9.

okcjim
okcjim 5pts

Can Derek Fisher guard Earl Watson?

El Prez
El Prez 5pts

 @okcjim

  I think he can stay 'near' Earl Watson. We just have to hope Brooks doesn't put Fisher on the big Russian.

OBoy
OBoy 5pts like.author.displayName 1 Like

 @okcjim Earl Watson needs guarded? since when?

THUNDER FOR THE WIN
THUNDER FOR THE WIN 5pts

 @okcjim derick fisher couldnt guard grandma

SniperJones035
SniperJones035 5pts like.author.displayName 1 Like

even like this  http://cdn.fansided.com/wp-content/blogs.dir/157/files/2013/03/7090174.jpg

 

brewer looks more productive than fisher!

Tronchaser
Tronchaser 5pts like.author.displayName like.author.displayName like.author.displayName like.author.displayName like.author.displayName 5 Like

Is it safe to come back?

f5alcon
f5alcon 5pts

 @Tronchaser I think so, just blaming brooks and fisher, normal stuff

OBoy
OBoy 5pts like.author.displayName like.author.displayName 2 Like

 @Tronchaser no

Tronchaser
Tronchaser 5pts like.author.displayName like.author.displayName like.author.displayName 3 Like

 @OBoy *closes door behind him*

long arm of the law
long arm of the law 5pts like.author.displayName like.author.displayName like.author.displayName 3 Like

Really good discussion this morning guys!  

SniperJones035
SniperJones035 5pts like.author.displayName like.author.displayName like.author.displayName like.author.displayName like.author.displayName like.author.displayName 6 Like

scott brooks on brewer.

 

"there's not a lot of minutes right now".

 

umm, so how comes fisher is getting so much for his age and is doing basically nothing?

 

*bangs head on desk*

TaoMaas
TaoMaas 5pts

 @SniperJones035   I'm not sure what's going on, but Brewer hasn't really shown me much these last couple of times he's been on the floor.  I was hoping for a lot more because when he first got to play, you could see him trying and I thought he'd be earning minutes in no time.  But now he's had time to practice with the team some, but he's more invisible than before!  If he's also doing this in practice, I can understand why he's not playing more.

okcjim
okcjim 5pts like.author.displayName 1 Like

@TaoMaas @SniperJones035 His last meaningful minutes he held Kobe Bryant scoreless for 5 minutes. That's pretty good in comparison to the Fisher stats in Tramels article.

f5alcon
f5alcon 5pts like.author.displayName like.author.displayName like.author.displayName like.author.displayName 4 Like

 @SniperJones035 Fisher has more games with 0 points than he does with 1+

This comment has been deleted

f5alcon
f5alcon 5pts like.author.displayName like.author.displayName 2 Like

 @SniperJones035 not a lie, 4 games with 0 points, 3 games with points. Since playing for us. Even Orton is better than that and he just gets garbage minutes.

sammasaaron
sammasaaron 5pts

The worst part of Fisher's 12 minutes is that we played a 38 yr old for 12 minutes on the second night of a back-to-back, 4th game in 5 days, on the road against the only team in the West with a better record. Worst parts?

beelieve035
beelieve035 5pts like.author.displayName like.author.displayName like.author.displayName like.author.displayName like.author.displayName 5 Like

Just read the Tramel article on 'Why Fisher?':

 

"Brewer played 24 minutes a game last season for the Chicago Bulls, which had the NBA’s best record. He fell out of the rotation this season with the Knickerbockers, and he hasn’t worked himself into the rotation with the Thunder. In 18 days since the trade, Brewer has played just four games and 28 minutes.

 

But the Thunder likes to bill itself as a defensive-minded team. Let me tell you who’s a defensive-minded team. The Bulls. Do you want to make decisions like the Bulls or the Knicks?"

 

El Prez
El Prez 5pts like.author.displayName 1 Like

 @beelieve035

  Tramel's blog stuff on the Thunder is much better than the feature stuff he writes for the paper  where he dumbs down to accommodate the OU football fan crossover casual fan. I like his Thunder blog material.

long arm of the law
long arm of the law 5pts like.author.displayName like.author.displayName 2 Like

 @beelieve035 Brewer was getting minutes early in the year for the Knicks. At the time they were playing nearly phenomenal defense (at least it was great for them).  Once he got squeezed from the rotation they went back to being a turnstile defense.

okcjim
okcjim 5pts

I'm liking Dario Saric the more I see of him (as a draft prospect).  He's a 6'9 230 pound 18 year old Croatian 3/4 that can shoot it, he has a good motor and is a really, really good passer.   He even has run some pg for some of his teams.  NBAdraft.net has him at 15 right now, ESPN, 18, SI.com 18 and draftexpress 27.  I posted something about him yesterday but I've watched a little more on him and I think he could be a good one. 

 

 http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=vNqpjnuUvqQ

f5alcon
f5alcon 5pts

 @okcjim if he falls to our pick fine, but I wouldn't reach at 10 to grab him.

AlexR44
AlexR44 5pts

 @f5alcon  @okcjim

 Trade down to about 13-15 range, grab an asset in the process, and still pick up a player like this.

TaoMaas
TaoMaas 5pts

 @AlexR44  @okcjim  @f5alcon   Wow...good lookin' player!  And he's even sportin' a mohawk, like Serge or The Beard!  He's perfect!

AlexR44
AlexR44 5pts like.author.displayName 1 Like

 @okcjim  @f5alcon

 I like the kid. He has some swagger to him. European players that have swagger are usually successful (Rubio, Gallinari, Valunciunas). It's the ones that have the deer in the headlight look that usually disappoint.

okcjim
okcjim 5pts

@AlexR44@f5alcon

f5alconWe could do a lot worse at 10 than him.  I like him better than Plumlee, Carter-Williams, Isaiah Austin, Poythress, etc... There are a lot of guys currently ranked higher that I don't like as much.  If the guys we like are gone I think this guy is a good prospect.  Maybe like Alex says trade down and get him or package some of our other picks to move up if he starts to slide.

 

SniperJones035
SniperJones035 5pts

 @okcjim

 not a good way to start the day.

 

draft picks can't help us now.

and we have a game tonight!

Heatforever
Heatforever 5pts

@SniperJones035 @okcjim Omg thunder suk!!!! Lets go heat!!!! !!

okcjim
okcjim 5pts like.author.displayName 1 Like

 @SniperJones035Just something else to talk about besides Fisher and Perkins. 

 

long arm of the law
long arm of the law 5pts like.author.displayName like.author.displayName 2 Like

Might be homerish but I think we can get 9 wins through the rest of March. Here's hoping.

f5alcon
f5alcon 5pts

 @see-mittens We had better, need to regain some lead over the stiffs, the last thing I want is to lose the division to them.

long arm of the law
long arm of the law 5pts like.author.displayName like.author.displayName like.author.displayName like.author.displayName like.author.displayName like.author.displayName like.author.displayName like.author.displayName like.author.displayName 9 Like

This last stretch of games was actually pretty brutal. Hit all 4 time zones. Included DST.  7100 miles traveled. 7 games, 5 on the road. Combined winning percentage of 57% (Taking out Bobcats it was 63%)  6 Playoff teams. 

 

All in 11 days.

long arm of the law
long arm of the law 5pts

Also, of note.  The spurs were on a 15 day home stand that included only 6 games. 

 

We've passed them on miles traveled at this point

 

We are 1.75 times around the earth so far.

SniperJones035
SniperJones035 5pts like.author.displayName 1 Like

 @see-mittens

 it's a good thing we aren't the lakers or some old slow ass team.

Thunder up. let's have a brand new start tonight and get back on track.

El Prez
El Prez 5pts like.author.displayName like.author.displayName like.author.displayName 3 Like

 @see-mittens

  All the more reason Fisher shouldn't have seen much of the floor in the road games against Denver, Clips and San Antonio. The second quarters at Denver and San Antonio were inexcusable from a coaching standpoint. Brooks must agree with us somewhat because Fisher sat for six consecutive quarters from halftime of the Denver game thru all of the Clipper game. Why put your team in a more disadvantageous position when you're going through a stretch like this? Tramel has an excellent piece.... 'Why Derek Fisher' on his blog this morning. Couldn't agree more. Now...tonight, at home where the other second unit players shoot the ball better...you would think Fisher should be all right when Earl Watson is on the floor.James Harden is gone...our coach just can't sit there on automatic pilot with second unit rotations. Every game according to foe...might need to be tweaked just a bit with second unit rotations.

long arm of the law
long arm of the law 5pts like.author.displayName like.author.displayName like.author.displayName like.author.displayName like.author.displayName like.author.displayName like.author.displayName 7 Like

 @El Prez My biggest issue is that this team has always been about earning your spot. Working your way into the rotation. Showing up in practice consistently to get a chance.  Fish was immediately inserted. I know these guys respect fish a ton but it just seems to go against the very nature of this team and the way it functions.  When anything is functioning at its highest level the smallest changes can have a HUGE affect.  

 

 

THUNDER FOR THE WIN
THUNDER FOR THE WIN 5pts

 @see-mittens  @El Prez this team is always about buckets

TaoMaas
TaoMaas 5pts

 @see-mittens   Oddly enough, I think Hash may be a case of Brooks doing what everyone wants him to do...play folks only when the match-ups are right.

TaoMaas
TaoMaas 5pts

 @see-mittens   I'm not sure why, but Liggins seemed to have lost his minutes prior to Fish coming on-board.  Same with the rooks...Fish isn't really stealing time from them.  Regarding Reggie...I'm beginning to wonder if he's the reason Fish is playing so much.  Like maybe Fish helps keep him settled down or something.  Regardless, I wouldn't say Fish has hurt Reggie's confidence because he seems to be playing with a lot more swagger than anyone except maybe Russ these last few games.  lol  I'm not trying to make excuses for playing Fish so much.  I'm just asking, "Why?"  In no way do I believe it's because Brooks is incompetent.  You don't have the degree of success he's had and keep improving your team every year...while avoiding any hint of unrest among the players...if you don't know what you're doing.

long arm of the law
long arm of the law 5pts

 @TaoMaas also hash appears to have been completely removed.

long arm of the law
long arm of the law 5pts

 @TaoMaas this season.  Last season there was a decent reason for him to immediately be inserted. This season you have him taking minutes from guys who spent over half the season earning those minutes. Liggins is shelved. Rookies have zero chance.  and Reggie's confidence was probably rocked. 

El Prez
El Prez 5pts like.author.displayName like.author.displayName 2 Like

 @see-mittens

 Last year...I was fine with it because Reggie was nowhere near ready for post season. But even last year---Brooks lost himself in Fisher to the point where Fisher averaged 25 minutes a game in the Finals. This year...not the case. Fisher should not be an automatic rotational player every night. Again...the baseball analogy...when you have a thirty-eight year old  pitcher who's fastball has gone from 94 mph to 80 mph...you pick your spots for him in middle relief situations.

TaoMaas
TaoMaas 5pts

 @see-mittens    Are you talking about Fish immediately playing this season or last season?  Last year, we desperately needed help on our second team.  That's why Fish played immediately.  This year, I think Brooks is using Fish because of his experience from last year with the team.

f5alcon
f5alcon 5pts

 @El Prez  Brooks loves fisher, probably because they are the same generation and actually remember the 80s.

f5alcon
f5alcon 5pts

 @El Prez Derek and Scott sitting in a tree...

El Prez
El Prez 5pts like.author.displayName 1 Like

 @f5alcon

  Then they need to get engaged and Sam Presti needs to find him a ball coach.

Trackbacks

  1. Kobe Bryant opens up in extended interview with Mike Wilbon | The Point Forward - SI.com says:
    March 12, 2013 at 5:20 pm

    [...] • Shortly after OKC signed Derek Fisher for the remainder of the season, Thunder head coach Scott Brooks made clear that he intended to play Fisher regularly. He’s thus far lived up that threat, including giving Fisher some burn during a crucial stretch of Monday night’s game against the Spurs. Royce Young of Daily Thunder reflects on that decision: [...]

  2. OKC Loud Links: March 13 - Sports Mania says:
    March 13, 2013 at 11:01 am

    [...] 5 leftovers from San Antonio | Daily Thunder [...]

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