The league released this statement in regard to the Thunder forfeiting a second round pick in the Jeff Green-Kendrick Perkins trade:
As part of a ruling in a trade disclosure dispute between the Boston Celtics and the Oklahoma City Thunder, NBA Commissioner David Stern today awarded the Celtics a 2013 second-round draft pick held by the Thunder. Stern found that there was no evidence of bad faith or any intent to withhold information on the part of Thunder management or its physicians, but that Oklahoma City’s cardiologists were in possession of information about Jeff Green that was not shared with Thunder management and that should have been disclosed to the Celtics in connection with the trade of Green in February 2011.
Under NBA rules, teams are required to disclose to each other in connection with trades any information in their possession or control about a player’s prior injuries, illnesses, or other health conditions that could affect the player’s ability to play NBA basketball at any point in the future. Green had surgery on his heart in January 2012 and did not play during the
2011-12 season.
Anyone read that lengthy piece on Grantland about Royce White? Interesting as hell although the article makes the kid's body sound frailer than a couple of octogenarians in a mud wrestling contest
@duhsweetness For many players, the draft process is significantly more physically demanding than the day-to-day of an NBA career. I think most players probably have sore knees or lingering pain in a back from a particularly tough stretch of workouts. Combine that with exhibiting your skills for teams, long hours in planes and inconsistent sleep and I'm sure nobody's body feels great.
I was just reading Hollinger's old draft rater articles and this guy should have lost all credibility by now. In his 2011 article:
http://es.pn/jnO1Hs
He claims that he had Westbrook as the 7th best point guard of the previous decade. I went through the archives to see what he actually said about Westbrook in 2008 before the draft:
http://es.pn/MpJiFm
Where he had Westbrook as the 9th best wing of 2008 and put him in the riff-raff category. Here's the quote:
"Though Westbrook is seen by many as a point guard, he actually rated even worse when I tried him there. It's possible he was just playing out of position at UCLA, but the projections say it's not worth using a top-10 pick to find out."
Now, I'm not trying to call him out for being wrong on Westbrook but don't try to misrepresent your predictions. What a joke!
I say, regardless of how uncomfortable I am with this mess, that the Thunder need to go ahead and make it public that they are making a change with their medical personnel. Trades are as much a function of trust and good relationships in this league as they are about the players and contracts. This makes the Thunder look either incompetent or shady, and that isn't going to work going forward.
At any point in the future? Did they reveal to the Celtics that Jeff Green is mortal and will almost assuredly die at some point? That he's made of meat and bone and tendon and those things have a tendency to break and tear? Jeff Green has two eyes that could at some point in the future cease to function as well if not, heaven forbid, entirely. If OKC didn't spell out all of these things to those poor unwitting souls in Boston we may have to send them some more compensation down the line.
@Fuzzy Logic
Except with this fuzzy logic, I suppose you'd never hold a car dealer responsible for selling you a "lemon" as it's going to end up in the junkyard someday anyway? :)
@ThunderChick2010 Depends... in this scenario do I have my own team of mechanics do a full workup on the vehicle prior to purchasing it and then devoted to keeping it running afterwards?
Trade machine says: Perk, Cook and Harden to Orlando for Howard. Makes us +6. Good trade? maybe for us!?!
The trade also works with Ibaka added to it but makes us -2. This one I could actually believe as the Magic would likely feel they have gotten a competitive value for Howard. (I tried to put Bass in there too, but he was locked under trade excemption?)
We're only a week into the off season... sigh...
@ThunderBelize Howard would have to agree to an extension upon the trade to even consider making an offer. With that disclaimer out of the way, it wouldn't be a terrible trade.
I'm beginning to think the trade that makes more sense next year is Westbrook, Cook, and Perkins for Nelson, Reddick, and Howard. Westbrook is obviously the value, and Perkins is the defensive C that allows them to keep Anderson shooting. Nelson makes as much as Perk, while Reddick makes twice as much as Cook. Orlando saves about 10 million next year in the trade (which OKC completely absorbs). This likely puts both teams still over the luxury tax. But, 10 million to Orlando is actually 20 million in actual savings. We would be roughly 2 million over the tax, and we could realistically drop 2 million in low level trades.
For Orlando, this gives them another superstar with zero injury risk coming off a finals appearance. This gives them a cheaper Reddick replacement and a quality defensive C to keep their overall defensive scheme in order. The monetary savings as well are tremendous.
For OKC, this swaps one superstar for arguably the second best player in the league. It provides an average starting PG in return to run the team who is a decent defender and good shooter. It replaces Cook with Reddick, which is about even. It also just balances the team more. Howard scores in the post, rebounds, and defends everyone well. It gives us three shooters in the starting lineup (Nelson, Harden, KD) around Howard, and puts the ball more easily in the hands of our best players.
Harden would be traded light years before Westbrook ever would.
I really, really like this trade(although I would miss Russ outrageously). With DH rebounding and defending the post we have some amazing line-up possibilities.
We could go big with a front line of KD, Ibaka and DH up front. How terrifying is that to other teams in the league? Sooo much length.
We could go small and really not be small at all against a team like Miami with Nelson, Thabo, Beard, KD and DH.
The more I think about it, the more I would love to see that small ball line-up as our starting line-up against any team with a really good wing scorer. Ibaka as our new sixth man would be sick too and he could get plenty of minutes backing up KD and DH and Harden with KD sliding to the 3.
@Zach99 Again, i don't think RW is even a plausible piece in this trade. JH, Ibaka and most anyone else may be, but it even without RW in the fold it has legitimate probability and appeal to both teams.
@Keith00 We're not trading Westbrook. End of story. Any trade scenario involving his name is lunacy.
@Keith00 I don't think it's a knock on Russ in anyway. If anything, it's acknowledgement of how far he's come and his future potential.
I really don't believe there is a team out there that could give Orlando more value for Dwight than OKC.
But like you said, it depends on Dwight extending here, and that's just never going to happen, which is probably why OKC-Orlando talks have never been serious.
I love Russ more than most and though it would break my heart to see him leave, there's only two players in the league you don't trade for Dwight, and that's Durant and LeBron.
I don't see why Russ is so unconditionally untouchable. We aren't talking about trading him for scraps. We aren't even talking about making a lateral swap (Rose). Dwight is better than Russ.
I can understand having an emotional preference not to trade, but since we are already taking certain leaps, I don't think it behooves us to accept that any player can be traded if we receive someone better in return.
@Keith00 Good analysis. Emotionally I'm not ready to ship RW - which is why I suggested Harden (sign and trade with Harden getting more than he would had he stayed in OKC). I wouldn't object to Nelson, but I don't think I'd include him in the trade if I was Orlando (again leaving RW off the block). Again I think Ibaka would be an acceptable loss to make this trade happen as well - given that Howard fills the blocks and defensive roll pretty well.
The funny thing is that both ORL and OKC have the parts to make a trade focused around Howard and either RW/JH legitimately work. The sad thing is there is less than 1% chance of it happening.
Would be one hell of a big a 3 though... KD, RW and Howard... seriously top 2 players at those 3 positions with our inside scoring and rebounding issues solved.
Orlando gets young, proven talent in return along with the Big defensive center as you pointed out.
At the very least it would shut Chuck up about us being a jump shooting team!! LOL!
It is all on Howard. If he wants to win, and win a LOT, he would come here. There is simply no other team (besides Miami or Chicago - and Chicago can't take on money without sending back overpaid players) that can offer him the kind of legacy OKC could. Howard will be all of 27 next year, and players like him tend to age well. He could be a superstar for the next 6 years easy, and every single one of those years could result in a championship.
@ThunderBelize That trade plus drafting Jeff Taylor would be amazing.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LM3XZb4duH0&feature=player_embedded
Not sure if anyone cares, but this brings back memories.
This is LeBron James' first game in the L. Crazy to see.
Nobody else feel that sting I feel and all you have to say "who cares about the 2nd rounder"?
Of course it was good to get rid of Green in terms of baskeball, and I agree that that pick doesn't matter at all. But if they knew about his condition this was so wrong on all accounts. Make no mistake, if the "cardiologists" of OKC knew, then management of course knew as well.
Green could have died on the court and they don't tell anyone? This is horrible.
@wannabeGM but didnt stern say himself he investigated it and there was no evidence of bad faith?
@Legendary_dork Since when do we believe Stern? Come on...as a Thunder fan, I don't want to believe this either, but these news are disturbing. There are no coincidences like that. And how would the Thunder not know if their docs knew? Don't know what to make of this. There are more important things than basketball.
@ThunderChick2010 @wannabeGM @Legendary_dork The team ended the Chandler trade because his toe hurt. I think if they knew anything, they would have shut it down.
@wannabeGM @Legendary_dork
What a mess; we'll probably never know the full story--especially if we're counting on Stern to deliver it to us. As a Thunder fan, I'm willing to give our team's management the benefit of the doubt here. I think they've conducted themselves in such a way over the last few years as to earn that.
I would give up 2nd picks indefinitely if that's what it took to get rid of Jeff Green
ummm Doctor, patient confidentiality
@OkcBaby That's waived as part of standard NBA contracts.
What do you guys think of this trade?
http://espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=6tz3n4b
@EatSleepThunder STOP GIVING STERN IDEAS! lol
@EatSleepThunder Considering Rashard Lewis doesn't even play for Washington anymore...
@S4TISF4CTION Yeah, because *thats* what is wrong with the trade
@EatSleepThunder hey any of these would make draft day more exciting
@EatSleepThunder These are hilarious.
@EatSleepThunder Wizards get robbed of uhh Kevin Seraphin?
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@MisterJohnsonOKC Why not this one? http://espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=6wqqmsz
@MisterJohnsonOKC http://espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=727bqva
Who does everyone realistically want to draft at number 28, assuming we do keep the pick? I really like Draymond Green's work ethic and personality.
Attention ESPN board members. I was banned less than an hour ago. Currently stuck on my backup account. What was I banned for? Replying to Seattle trolls on the board.
@vikings321 Who cares, it's just an ESPN comment section. Dregs of the internet along with YouTube comments and 4chan.
@Jooseppi Ok, but I have been posting there since 1997, and the account I have kept was "vikings321" and has been active since 1999. It just hurts that the trolls actually are beating us and having good OKC fans banned just for defending our team and owners from the trolls.
You were banned from RealGM because you could not enter a topic without being a baiting lunatic.
@vikings321 @El @Jooseppi just stick here as far as basketball goes. Espn boards are the basement of hell in sports talk.
@ElMexiThunder @El @vikings321 @Jooseppi
Ok, I understand you guys don't care. I would love to just switch to DailyThunder but they don't have a board as far as i know. You can't create a topic of your own. the only choice is to reply to whatever update is added on the site.
@El Prez @vikings321 @Jooseppi ^ thats all i got to say.
@vikings321 @Jooseppi Sigh.
Replying at the same level they were treating us. I was actually banned for posting a picture of Aubrey McClendon and Kate Upton in reply to a Seattle fans post about Aubrey.
wow Keith Smart is trying to get the whole Kings team to go to summer league
So the team didn't turn over information that they didn't have, and the punishment is to take away an asset we didn't have at the time of the alleged not-handing-over of the non-existant information. Makes sense to me... #fail
@Tapdog72 I think my brain just exploded a little
@Tapdog72 only in america!
@Tapdog72
Your assessment of the situation explains it perfectly though. You perfectly captured the essence of the whole mess.